Mcd says we haven't got any cash....

[Victor Meldrew]

By his own admission JM got lucky with the business idea that he got from USA,selling cars by showing photographs rather than just using words.
That really has very little to do with this discussion but I felt it needed pointing out.

[Royal Rother]

It doesn't matter where the idea comes from, luck has very little to do with building a business over a period of 20 years from nothing to a value of £200m.

[Terminal Boardom]

It was South Africa. HTH

[Ian Royal]

Luck played it's part in our manner of promotion. But it was all round good management of the team and the club that got got us promoted at all. All on a medium and not short term basis.

If you play the percentages carefully, then sooner or later it's likely to pay off and you'll get a bit lucky and mount one (or more) strong promotion pushes (02/03, 04/05 & 08/09). And sooner or later one of those will work. But you have to be hovering around lower to upper mid-table consistently to be able to do that.

This was the same chairman that hired Terry Bullivant, Mark McGhee, Pards, and Tommy Burns.
Just as in his business empire, some decisions pay off, others don't. He ain't infallible.
He stated the club's ambition was to get in the Prem, but let's be realistic; he says that every year because he's in the bums on seats business.

For me the true kudos for the Championship winning/8th in the Prem team lies with the scouting/coaching/team management staff, and a group of players who stepped up to the plate, and collectively raised their game a couple of notches.
To suggest it had much to do with the chairman, in my opinion, stretches sycophancy a bit far.

Who said he's infallible? I certainly didn't.

His ambition is to take us and keep us in the Premier League. Of course he restates it whenever it comes up. It's the goal of the club. I don't understand why so many people have such trouble grasping the concept that saying it doesn't necessarily mean he wants to push all out for it now. An ambition can be something you intend to fulfill in a 3, 5, 10 or 100 year plan.

Sycophancy my arse. Who put the manager in place? JM. Who put the DoF in place? JM. Who played a part in making sure we had the coaching and scouting staff we needed? JM. Who ran the club so it could afford the players? JM. Who ran the club so it could build and use the facilities it had? JM.
That's not sycophancy that's acknowledgement of the important role the man with the purse strings at the top played. It's also acknowledging that football isn't just a string of totally isolated single seasons.

Without the good management of the club, the good management of the team couldn't have happened in the way it did, to the extent it did. Without that good management of the team, we couldn't have achieved promotion in the manner we did. Although I still think we'd have gone up eventually anyway.

Coppell hired the likes of Morgan, Owusu, Keown, Fae and many others. THat doesn't negate his fantastic job or impact here. Although some will try and tell you it does. So your point about Bullivant and Burns are utterly irrelevant unless you're trying to prove Madejski isn't infallible. Which nobody has said at any point.

You can't have it both ways, and you appear to be trying to.

[Sun Tzu]

It was South Africa. HTH

I don't think it was...

'While on holiday in Florida in the mid 1970s Madejski saw a car sales magazine that included pictures of the vehicles on sale. He immediately realised the potential of the idea, and founded Thames Valley Trader in 1976.'

I actually thought he was working in the States, but whatever.

[Smoking Kills Dancing Doe]

He was working on the front desk for the Evening Post.

I'm sure you can all rest easy now we've got that tantalising point out.

Now back on point. Where's the money gone?!

[RoyalBlue]

It doesn't matter where the idea comes from, luck has very little to do with building a business over a period of 20 years from nothing to a value of £200m.

Accepting that, then surely the same argument will apply if the businesses start to go tits up!

[under the tin]

The context was your analysis of the reasons why we achieved promotion to the PL.

Precisely. This isn't an Auto Trader forum. How you can extrapolate my comments and imply that I include his print empire is beyond me.

Without the good management of the club, the good management of the team couldn't have happened in the way it did, to the extent it did. Without that good management of the team, we couldn't have achieved promotion in the manner we did. Although I still think we'd have gone up eventually anyway.

That would be the same good management that appointed Terry Bullivant?
Sorry, but it sounds to me that it is you who wants is both ways.
Ok, so some think that the 106/8th team was the inevitable product of a long term strategy by the chairman, I think it was the result of some extremely good scouting, a manager who could spot a player, and those players raising their game collectively. Somehow I just can't buy into the concept that Jm planned on picking up a bloke who was parking supermarket trollies, and a little Irishman who couldn't get into Brentford's team, and turning them into players woth a combined £10M.
Let's just beg to differ.

For the purposes of clarity, this contributor believes that the most important ingredients in a professional football club are the quality of the playing staff, the coaching, and the management of those players. Only when you are a Manchester City,etc, does the boardroom directly affect this.
I am not here to spend Jm's money for him. What I am concerned about is the club remaining competitive at this level.
If we go too far down the road of selling the best bits of the club's family silver, then the club will, in my view, end up competing at a different level. Solvent. Good. Well run. Good. League 1. Bad.

[brendywendy]

so some think that the 106/8th team was the inevitable product of a long term strategy by the chairman, I think it was the result of some extremely good scouting, a manager who could spot a player, and those players raising their game collectively.

not lets not beg to differ
these arent mutually exclusive in any way.
it was the result of jms long term strategy, the clubs scouting, the players raising their game in response to coppell and coaches, and a bit of luck.
but as far as JMs role goes he was totally successful in it.

[under the tin]

so some think that the 106/8th team was the inevitable product of a long term strategy by the chairman, I think it was the result of some extremely good scouting, a manager who could spot a player, and those players raising their game collectively.

not lets not beg to differ
these arent mutually exclusive in any way.
it was the result of jms long term strategy, ??????????
If Pardew had stayed put, Coppell would have stayed at Brighton
the clubs scouting, the players raising their game in response to coppell and coaches, and a bit of luck.
but as far as JMs role goes he was totally successful in it.

Come off it. Jm, like any employer, interviews prospective staff, and hires them by following his instincts.
Just the same as any other employer, sometimes the new staff do well, other times they don't work out.
And in exactly the same way, his line manager, Coppell, hired footballers. Sometimes they're Halfords, sometimes they're Kitsons.
Planned for? Strategy?

[Hoop Blah]

Madejski is the man responsible for creating the culture and environment for both Coppell and Pardew to operate in though. Without that the wouldn't have been able to bring in the players they did.

I agree the quality of the players is the most influencing factor in a clubs on the field success, but, without the right structure at the club those players would never come together.

It's a bit chicken and egg, but to belittle Madejski's contribution is just plain stupid.

[sheshnu]

Are we all not currently enjoying the most successful period in the club's history? Does anybody seriously think that's not almost entirely thanks to one man? (And us fans, of course).

[under the tin]

Are we all not currently enjoying the most successful period in the club's history? Does anybody seriously think that's not almost entirely thanks to one man? (And us fans, of course).

That point is inarguable.
Maybe we peaked 3 years ago, but how far back down do we have to slide from where we once came from before it is politically correct to worry?

[brendywendy]

it depends- personally i just follow the team, i dont think i can have any influence on teh club by worrying, and know full well that ill still watch the games if we are in div1/2

[sheshnu]

'greed, worrying about stuff you have no control over probably isn't a healthy way to be spending your time.

Reading may never be as good again as they were over the last five years. Or they might be - it's nobody's 'fault', it's just where the club is. And I think the point is that while Mr Mad is in charge, there will always be a club there for you.

[under the tin]

I've spent most of my Reading-supporting life watching us play in the nether reaches of pro football, and apart from the away derby games, have only a handful of fond memories of that time.
Were we to go back to that level, with a chairman with the mindset such as ours has, it would take an almost superhuman effort to reach the level at which we are now competing.
If this happens, then the experience will have gone full circle, and I will again see kids in Prospect park running around in the usual Premiership suspects shirts, as opposed to the plentiful hoops we see there today.
No, I have no influence over club policies, and cannot lend McD a million or so to bolster the team. All I can do is to express my concerns about the general direction in which my beloved club is heading.
Maybe I will end up standing next to Rother at a Windsor & Eton home game against Reading one day. But hey ho, we're solvent.

[sheshnu]

Oh cheer up. It'll rarely be terrible and rarely be amazing, and most of the time watching Reading will be pretty much like it was on Saturday.

[brendywendy]

I've spent most of my Reading-supporting life watching us play in the nether reaches of pro football, and apart from the away derby games, have only a handful of fond memories of that time.

the vast majority of the fond memories were at elm park, in the nether reaches
not saying i want to go back there, but in essence, theres not much different.
weve managed to get ourselves to the point, which we are still at that we are expected to be a mid-upper table championship team, and if we ever get to yo yo again we will use the extra revenues to grow the club bit by bit.
thats exactly where i want us to be in all honesty, and i seriously dont understand all the hand wringing

[under the tin]

I've spent most of my Reading-supporting life watching us play in the nether reaches of pro football, and apart from the away derby games, have only a handful of fond memories of that time.

the vast majority of the fond memories were at elm park, in the nether reaches
not saying i want to go back there, but in essence, theres not much different.
weve managed to get ourselves to the point, which we are still at that we are expected to be a mid-upper table championship team, and if we ever get to yo yo again we will use the extra revenues to grow the club bit by bit.
thats exactly where i want us to be in all honesty, and i seriously dont understand all the hand wringing

That's because we have a fundamental disagreement about exactly how the success on the pitch was achieved.
You are in the camp that believes that success was down to dilligent work by the chairman.
I sincerely believe that it was the club's "golden ticket". A squad assembled for relatively peanuts, with a superb coaching management team, and those players performing at a level that prevoiusly they had not achieved. It all just "clicked".
In life, windows of opportunity do not come along often. When they do, they should be seized upon, and maximised.
The club missed out on a return to the Prem. (No tears shed here)
The hot air balloon is decending, and now the chairman has nicked the propane gas cylinder.
I'm not talking about us signing Messi, but just how far back do we fall?

[brendywendy]

You are in the camp that believes that success was down to dilligent work by the chairman.
I sincerely believe that it was the club's "golden ticket". A squad assembled for relatively peanuts, with a superb coaching management team, and those players performing at a level that prevoiusly they had not achieved. It all just "clicked".

utter rollocks

ive already said its down to all of those things combined. but you seem to want to discount th efact that JM had anything to do with it. when in fact he hired SSC, andf put in place the systems and controls and staff that made the 106 at all possible.

aND ALL OF THAT IS IRRELEVANT TO WHY I CANT UNDERSTAND ALL THE HAND WRINGING- BY ALL MEANS IF WE SELL KEBE MCANUFF AND SIG - THEN START WRINGING HANDS AND WORRYING IF IT MAKES YOU FEEL BETTER- BUT UNTIL THEN DONT BOTHER.
AT THE POINT WHERE WE ARE RELEGATED DUE TO LACK OF INVESTMENT, THEN MOAN LIKE BUGGERY IF YOU LIKE

IM JUST SAYING THAT SITTING THERE SAYING OOOO WE ARE GOING TO SELL ALL OUR GOOD PLAYERS BEFORE THE WINDOW CLOSES, OOO WE WILL BE A LEAGUE 1 TEAM, IS RUBBISH, AND ACHIEVES oxf*rd ALL.
CARRY ON IF YOU LIKE THOUGH


(oops caps)