New CEO/Midfield 2for1 thread (Can we sign a Player-CEO fill both roles?)

[Forbury Lion]

Why have our midfield been so rubbish at tackling and stopping the ball getting through to defence? - Is it because the focus in training is on attack because the strikers/wingers were ineffective?

[Theroyalbox]

Absolutely fabulous thread title.

[NewCorkSeth]

Loving the duo threads.

[NewCorkSeth]

I suggested him before and was laughed out of town but player/CEO Flamini?

[leon]

This too.

Identifying an area we need a player in the last 4 years and signing Evans, JVDB, Williams, Meyler, Bacuna, Edwards, Quinn, Ezatolahi, Chalobah and Norwood in that time as well as promoting Tshibola indicates we haven't exactly been ignoring the position.

Yes not all of them are DMs but all are capable of playing there and (while not all consistent) most were capable of taking control of a game here and there.

Are you serious?

We have a midfield unit that gets continually bypassed and a defence that struggles as a result. None of our midfielders have been able, possibly Williams to a lesser degree, to actually defend whether that is a specific player in that role or as a unit.

We have done for several years now.

Yeah we’ve signed players but they haven’t been consistently effective - that was my point.

What club in the world signs players that are continuously effective? More importantly what championship club does that? The answer for both is none.

You're complaining that we haven't signed a DM capable of consistently making and impact... you're insane. We should also complain that we haven't signed a LB capable of consistently making an impact. Or a RB capable of consistently making an impact. Or a CB capable of consistantly making an impact. Or a winger capable of consistantly making an impact. Or a striker capable of consistantly making an impact.

The fact is since Mikele left we have had several players bought for that position that just haven't worked out as well as we would like. Evans looked like he could do it for a season. Bacuna certainly looked like being able to do it last season. Chalobah was able to do it. Ezatolahi certainly looks the dogs bollocks.

I think you're getting a little over excited NCS. My definition of consistency is basically being able to do the job over more than a handful of games. Liam Moore has been effective for example, I would say, the real issue we have is absolutely no shield from the midfield. Unless you disagree - having seen so many of our games in the last 4 years?

Evans did not do that really. Although I thought he had some potential.

Chalobah played 20 games (Ian?) and I have to say he was alright but nothing particularly special as he was still very young and learning.

Bacuna? Really????

It is too early to say that Ezatolahi is the answer he's played 4 (Thanks Ian!) games and is now injured. I am, however, hopeful he will be.

Anyway I suspect we won't agree, so little point in continuing.

[NewCorkSeth]

Are you serious?

We have a midfield unit that gets continually bypassed and a defence that struggles as a result. None of our midfielders have been able, possibly Williams to a lesser degree, to actually defend whether that is a specific player in that role or as a unit.

We have done for several years now.

Yeah we’ve signed players but they haven’t been consistently effective - that was my point.

What club in the world signs players that are continuously effective? More importantly what championship club does that? The answer for both is none.

You're complaining that we haven't signed a DM capable of consistently making and impact... you're insane. We should also complain that we haven't signed a LB capable of consistently making an impact. Or a RB capable of consistently making an impact. Or a CB capable of consistantly making an impact. Or a winger capable of consistantly making an impact. Or a striker capable of consistantly making an impact.

The fact is since Mikele left we have had several players bought for that position that just haven't worked out as well as we would like. Evans looked like he could do it for a season. Bacuna certainly looked like being able to do it last season. Chalobah was able to do it. Ezatolahi certainly looks the dogs bollocks.

I think you're getting a little over excited NCS. My definition of consistency is basically being able to do the job over more than a handful of games. Liam Moore has been effective for example, I would say, the real issue we have is absolutely no shield from the midfield. Unless you disagree - having seen so many of our games in the last 4 years?

Evans did not do that really. Although I thought he had some potential.

Chalobah played 20 games (Ian?) and I have to say he was alright but nothing particularly special as he was still very young and learning.

Bacuna? Really????

It is too early to say that Ezatolahi is the answer he's played 4 (Thanks Ian!) games and is now injured. I am, however, hopeful he will be.

Anyway I suspect we won't agree, so little point in continuing.

That last sentence has a touch of the "Ian Royals" about it. Argument is not about agreement.

You're original point was we haven't had a DM who can "influence a game in any meaningful way" in the last 4 years. That's bollocks. So you moved the goalposts and said that they also have had to sustained good form and play a particular type of DM tactic that none of ours have been asked to play bar Ezatolahi who has done it very well.

[leon]

What club in the world signs players that are continuously effective? More importantly what championship club does that? The answer for both is none.

You're complaining that we haven't signed a DM capable of consistently making and impact... you're insane. We should also complain that we haven't signed a LB capable of consistently making an impact. Or a RB capable of consistently making an impact. Or a CB capable of consistantly making an impact. Or a winger capable of consistantly making an impact. Or a striker capable of consistantly making an impact.

The fact is since Mikele left we have had several players bought for that position that just haven't worked out as well as we would like. Evans looked like he could do it for a season. Bacuna certainly looked like being able to do it last season. Chalobah was able to do it. Ezatolahi certainly looks the dogs bollocks.

I think you're getting a little over excited NCS. My definition of consistency is basically being able to do the job over more than a handful of games. Liam Moore has been effective for example, I would say, the real issue we have is absolutely no shield from the midfield. Unless you disagree - having seen so many of our games in the last 4 years?

Evans did not do that really. Although I thought he had some potential.

Chalobah played 20 games (Ian?) and I have to say he was alright but nothing particularly special as he was still very young and learning.

Bacuna? Really????

It is too early to say that Ezatolahi is the answer he's played 4 (Thanks Ian!) games and is now injured. I am, however, hopeful he will be.

Anyway I suspect we won't agree, so little point in continuing.

That last sentence has a touch of the "Ian Royals" about it. Argument is not about agreement.

You're original point was we haven't had a DM who can "influence a game in any meaningful way" in the last 4 years. That's bollocks. So you moved the goalposts and said that they also have had to sustained good form and play a particular type of DM tactic that none of ours have been asked to play bar Ezatolahi who has done it very well.

Yes I clarified later that doing it consistently was important. tbf I think that would be fairly apparent.

[El Diablo]

Are you serious?

We have a midfield unit that gets continually bypassed and a defence that struggles as a result. None of our midfielders have been able, possibly Williams to a lesser degree, to actually defend whether that is a specific player in that role or as a unit.

We have done for several years now.

Yeah we’ve signed players but they haven’t been consistently effective - that was my point.

What club in the world signs players that are continuously effective? More importantly what championship club does that? The answer for both is none.

You're complaining that we haven't signed a DM capable of consistently making and impact... you're insane. We should also complain that we haven't signed a LB capable of consistently making an impact. Or a RB capable of consistently making an impact. Or a CB capable of consistantly making an impact. Or a winger capable of consistantly making an impact. Or a striker capable of consistantly making an impact.

The fact is since Mikele left we have had several players bought for that position that just haven't worked out as well as we would like. Evans looked like he could do it for a season. Bacuna certainly looked like being able to do it last season. Chalobah was able to do it. Ezatolahi certainly looks the dogs bollocks.

I think you're getting a little over excited NCS. My definition of consistency is basically being able to do the job over more than a handful of games. Liam Moore has been effective for example, I would say, the real issue we have is absolutely no shield from the midfield. Unless you disagree - having seen so many of our games in the last 4 years?

Evans did not do that really. Although I thought he had some potential.

Chalobah played 20 games (Ian?) and I have to say he was alright but nothing particularly special as he was still very young and learning.

Bacuna? Really????

It is too early to say that Ezatolahi is the answer he's played 4 (Thanks Ian!) games and is now injured. I am, however, hopeful he will be.

Anyway I suspect we won't agree, so little point in continuing.

Just adding my tuppenthworth on this one, and agree Central Mid has been a shambles for years, but for me , its not just about one player its the partnership of the two in the middle thats been lacking. We've not acquired/ trained / developed a relationship between our center mid pairings for years, and for me thats been a coaching issue, coupled with a recruitment issue. Take that a step further and develop that center mid relationship with our CB's and then we'll stop being soft in that area. Its down to the Managemnt to do that.

[leon]

What club in the world signs players that are continuously effective? More importantly what championship club does that? The answer for both is none.

You're complaining that we haven't signed a DM capable of consistently making and impact... you're insane. We should also complain that we haven't signed a LB capable of consistently making an impact. Or a RB capable of consistently making an impact. Or a CB capable of consistantly making an impact. Or a winger capable of consistantly making an impact. Or a striker capable of consistantly making an impact.

The fact is since Mikele left we have had several players bought for that position that just haven't worked out as well as we would like. Evans looked like he could do it for a season. Bacuna certainly looked like being able to do it last season. Chalobah was able to do it. Ezatolahi certainly looks the dogs bollocks.

I think you're getting a little over excited NCS. My definition of consistency is basically being able to do the job over more than a handful of games. Liam Moore has been effective for example, I would say, the real issue we have is absolutely no shield from the midfield. Unless you disagree - having seen so many of our games in the last 4 years?

Evans did not do that really. Although I thought he had some potential.

Chalobah played 20 games (Ian?) and I have to say he was alright but nothing particularly special as he was still very young and learning.

Bacuna? Really????

It is too early to say that Ezatolahi is the answer he's played 4 (Thanks Ian!) games and is now injured. I am, however, hopeful he will be.

Anyway I suspect we won't agree, so little point in continuing.

Just adding my tuppenthworth on this one, and agree Central Mid has been a shambles for years, but for me , its not just about one player its the partnership of the two in the middle thats been lacking. We've not acquired/ trained / developed a relationship between our center mid pairings for years, and for me thats been a coaching issue, coupled with a recruitment issue. Take that a step further and develop that center mid relationship with our CB's and then we'll stop being soft in that area. Its down to the Managemnt to do that.

Agreed, however with a load of powder puff midfileders that we have had someone needed/needs to put their foot in.

[NewCorkSeth]

I think you're getting a little over excited NCS. My definition of consistency is basically being able to do the job over more than a handful of games. Liam Moore has been effective for example, I would say, the real issue we have is absolutely no shield from the midfield. Unless you disagree - having seen so many of our games in the last 4 years?

Evans did not do that really. Although I thought he had some potential.

Chalobah played 20 games (Ian?) and I have to say he was alright but nothing particularly special as he was still very young and learning.

Bacuna? Really????

It is too early to say that Ezatolahi is the answer he's played 4 (Thanks Ian!) games and is now injured. I am, however, hopeful he will be.

Anyway I suspect we won't agree, so little point in continuing.

Just adding my tuppenthworth on this one, and agree Central Mid has been a shambles for years, but for me , its not just about one player its the partnership of the two in the middle thats been lacking. We've not acquired/ trained / developed a relationship between our center mid pairings for years, and for me thats been a coaching issue, coupled with a recruitment issue. Take that a step further and develop that center mid relationship with our CB's and then we'll stop being soft in that area. Its down to the Managemnt to do that.

Agreed, however with a load of powder puff midfileders that we have had someone needed/needs to put their foot in.

How about we list every CM we've had since Mikele left and you write next to them a mark out of 100 on the "proper mid - powder puff scale"?

[El Diablo]

Just adding my tuppenthworth on this one, and agree Central Mid has been a shambles for years, but for me , its not just about one player its the partnership of the two in the middle thats been lacking. We've not acquired/ trained / developed a relationship between our center mid pairings for years, and for me thats been a coaching issue, coupled with a recruitment issue. Take that a step further and develop that center mid relationship with our CB's and then we'll stop being soft in that area. Its down to the Managemnt to do that.

Agreed, however with a load of powder puff midfileders that we have had someone needed/needs to put their foot in.

How about we list every CM we've had since Mikele left and you write next to them a mark out of 100 on the "proper mid - powder puff scale"?

Think the Club's ideas around playing style, ( pass /pass/pass/sideways/backwards/pass. etc etc) have driven the type of CM's we've signed over the last 4 years , so to your point they've not been particularly 'combative' type ....I agree , that we need to be , and the balance and understanding between the two / CB's is key.

[NewCorkSeth]

A. Kuhl
A. Tshibola
A. Rinomhota
D. Edwards
D. Guthrie
D. Meyler
D. Williams
G. Evans
H. Akpan
J. Karacan
J. Mutch
J. Swift
J. van den Berg
L. Bacuna
L. Kelly
N. Chalobah
O. Norwood
P. Clement
S. Ezatolahi
S. Quinn

[leon]

Just adding my tuppenthworth on this one, and agree Central Mid has been a shambles for years, but for me , its not just about one player its the partnership of the two in the middle thats been lacking. We've not acquired/ trained / developed a relationship between our center mid pairings for years, and for me thats been a coaching issue, coupled with a recruitment issue. Take that a step further and develop that center mid relationship with our CB's and then we'll stop being soft in that area. Its down to the Managemnt to do that.

Agreed, however with a load of powder puff midfileders that we have had someone needed/needs to put their foot in.

How about we list every CM we've had since Mikele left and you write next to them a mark out of 100 on the "proper mid - powder puff scale"?

Now who's getting all Ian Royal?


I'll start. out of 100 on powder puff scale. 100 is fully powder puff

Kelly 95/100
Swift 95/100
Bacuna 70/100

[NewCorkSeth]

Agreed, however with a load of powder puff midfileders that we have had someone needed/needs to put their foot in.

How about we list every CM we've had since Mikele left and you write next to them a mark out of 100 on the "proper mid - powder puff scale"?

Now who's getting all Ian Royal?


I'll start. out of 100 on powder puff scale. 100 is fully powder puff

Kelly 95/100
Swift 95/100
Bacuna 70/100

I made you a list above x

[leon]

How about we list every CM we've had since Mikele left and you write next to them a mark out of 100 on the "proper mid - powder puff scale"?

Now who's getting all Ian Royal?


I'll start. out of 100 on powder puff scale. 100 is fully powder puff

Kelly 95/100
Swift 95/100
Bacuna 70/100

I made you a list above x

I'll get round to it when I have the time sweet tits.

[Sutekh]

Would you see Nigel Howe as a box to box midfielder or more of a DM?

[NewCorkSeth]

Would you see Nigel Howe as a box to box midfielder or more of a DM?

Me? Think he's more of a regista.

[Snowflake Royal]

Joey and Evans did an ok job at times in Stam season 1. Norwood wasn't what I'd call a DM - he wasn't in there to win tackles, headers etc, and I didn't think it was very good for us

Williams did a fantastic job for about 5 months before he left us, but even then he was more an all round midfielder than a full on DM

Eza certainly showed us glimpses of being exactly the midfielder we need in there. Whether he can do that consistently when back fit, we'll hopefully soon find out

Norwood was actually very effective defensively. Regularly put in good tackles and interceptions.

I agree midfield has been an issue for a while, though regularly not the biggest one, and not because we lacked any one type of player or only had substandard players, but because we never built a balanced partnership in their with players who complemented each other and were properly supported by defence and attack.

There are several players in the time Leon's talking about who were plenty good enough.

Williams was nothing like a DM in my opinion.

[leon]

Joey and Evans did an ok job at times in Stam season 1. Norwood wasn't what I'd call a DM - he wasn't in there to win tackles, headers etc, and I didn't think it was very good for us

Williams did a fantastic job for about 5 months before he left us, but even then he was more an all round midfielder than a full on DM

Eza certainly showed us glimpses of being exactly the midfielder we need in there. Whether he can do that consistently when back fit, we'll hopefully soon find out

Norwood was actually very effective defensively. Regularly put in good tackles and interceptions.

I agree midfield has been an issue for a while, though regularly not the biggest one, and not because we lacked any one type of player or only had substandard players, but because we never built a balanced partnership in their with players who complemented each other and were properly supported by defence and attack.

There are several players in the time Leon's talking about who were plenty good enough.

Williams was nothing like a DM in my opinion.

Midfield is the absolute heartbeat of a team.

It can cover up your weaknesses and can propel a good team to be a great team. But it needs to do the dirty stuff - closing down, harrying, tackling, winning the ball etc.

We’ve lost that concept. The midfield we’ve had for some time doesn’t do that.

Sorry chaps, convince yourselves all you want but it just hasn’t and doesn’t.

[leon]

Anyway wrttop should we set up a poll on who we want?