BFTG Villa

[Pepe the Horseman]

Interesting how people can view things differently, I’ve seen a few people say they didn’t rate Miazga, Ejaria and Rinomhota - but I thought they all did very well.

I thought Miazga was MOTM personally. He had Abraham in his pocket

Was very concerned when Abraham got away from him in the first 5 and took the shot on goal

After that thought he was excellent. My motm as well

Love Rino but he was average. Surprised people think Ejaria was Motm - he looks a good player but not a lot came off for him

Yeh I'm not really getting the Ejaria love. Thought he was poor in the first half. He just seems to run himself into trouble, which tbf, he usually manages to get himself out of, but doesn't actually do much with the ball.

[URZZZZZZZZ]

Did anyone else notice the names of Pelle Clement, Dave Edwards and Josh Sims flash up on the pitch side boards when they read the team out?!

[Victor Meldrew]

Not sure about the Mings incident-it was not far from us and looked to be an accident at the time.
These cuts always look bad but I expect him to be o.k. by next week.

As for the game, an even first half although we had our usual early good save and the opposition hitting the woodwork but our general play was quite good.
For the first 25 minutes or so of the second half Villa were well on top but we survived and probably just about deserved the draw.

As I said in a pre-match topic ,Grealish makes Villa tick and it was a bonus that he didn't play.

I agree with others that all our loan players did well, apart from Baker who was anonymous, with the centre-back and keeper the best of the bunch IMHO.

There is still the little matter of making chances and scoring goals-if we draw all of the rest of our games we will be relegated-but in Oliveira we do have a striker who shapes and plays like a striker so there is hope.

[Sutekh]

Not sure about the Mings incident-it was not far from us and looked to be an accident at the time.
These cuts always look bad but I expect him to be o.k. by next week.

I’d call it as accidental. I was on that side and reasonably in line and didn’t think Mings could do a lot about where to put his feet as it was a bit of a tangle. Mings also immediately saw what had happened and got the ref to stop the game rather than let him play on which strikes me more of someone genuinely concerned and not a pre-meditated job where he could have just “sloped off” and played the innocent if the ref had done anything.

Additionally there was no “handbags” or negative reaction from Reading players nor particularly the fans at the time which does suggest just a very unfortunate accident.

How the FL and FA will view it of course remains to be seen.

I expect there to be a good few stitches needed for the injury and knowing Reading’s miserable luck with injures these days Oliveira may well miss the next 2/3 games. Hoping that’s not the case of course and that Parky’s face mask is still about if needed.

[Vicky Pollard]

Not sure about the Mings incident-it was not far from us and looked to be an accident at the time.
These cuts always look bad but I expect him to be o.k. by next week.

I’d call it as accidental. I was on that side and reasonably in line and didn’t think Mings could do a lot about where to put his feet as it was a bit of a tangle. Mings also immediately saw what had happened and got the ref to stop the game rather than let him play on which strikes me more of someone genuinely concerned and not a pre-meditated job where he could have just “sloped off” and played the innocent if the ref had done anything.

Additionally there was no “handbags” or negative reaction from Reading players nor particularly the fans at the time which does suggest just a very unfortunate accident.

How the FL and FA will view it of course remains to be seen.

I expect there to be a good few stitches needed for the injury and knowing Reading’s miserable luck with injures these days Oliveira may well miss the next 2/3 games. Hoping that’s not the case of course and that Parky’s face mask is still about if needed.

I think if you turn around and notice that the guy you have just stamped on has a massive gash on his face with blood pouring out, you'll suddenly look apologetic and claim it to be an accidental. Mings is a thug of a player with previous for this and should be getting an extensive ban. We are also probably now without a key player for a few games.

[sandman]

Can't believe anyone can see that as anything other than deliberate. The guilt may have hit him immediately afterwards once he saw the severity of what he'd done but he was looking down at Oliveira whilst he did it.

[Old Man Andrews]

Can't believe anyone can see that as anything other than deliberate. The guilt may have hit him immediately afterwards once he saw the severity of what he'd done but he was looking down at Oliveira whilst he did it.

Try watching it a full speed rather than slowed down to suit your story. In real time it's nowhere near as clear as you're making out. You have no idea if it was intentional or not, only Mings knows that answer.

[biff]

Imagine being that much of a simpering bedwetter you'd give that cnut the benefit of the doubt for extending his leg, pushing off of our own players head, and lacerating his face. You're trying too hard to be contrarian, he's got form, and it's about as blatant a stamp as you'll see.

His few strides afterwards not looking back smack of "lets pretend I had no idea what happened". A genuine accident would have been an instantaneous reaction. He looks down, and pushes off. Throw the book at him.

[leon]

I thought Miazga was MOTM personally. He had Abraham in his pocket

Was very concerned when Abraham got away from him in the first 5 and took the shot on goal

After that thought he was excellent. My motm as well

Love Rino but he was average. Surprised people think Ejaria was Motm - he looks a good player but not a lot came off for him

Yeh I'm not really getting the Ejaria love. Thought he was poor in the first half. He just seems to run himself into trouble, which tbf, he usually manages to get himself out of, but doesn't actually do much with the ball.

Exactly my thoughts. What is his position? He doesn’t look like a left sided player or really a centre mid.

He’s clearly got talent but he’s also got a really annoying loping stride that makes him look like he’s not running fast enough.

[Royal_jimmy]

It definitely looks more deliberate than intentional to me. The fact that he looked down to Oliveira's face as his foot followed through and stamped on him. The fact he stopped play doesn't mean it wasn't intentional or whether he felt guilty. The fact is he's done it before so there's always a chance he will do it again. Mings is an ex Ipswich player and Oliveira is a Norwich player so there's extra grounds to believe it was intentional. Lets hope he gets a ban and Nelson isn't out for long.

Back to the game. Thought we did ok. Villa were better than I expected given their poor form. They gave us stubborn opposition and a point isn't a disgrace. We didn't look like a relegation side.

Next 3 home games are huge though. Minimum of 7 points is required from those including a win v Rotherham.

[Nameless]

There’s a middle ground. It’s not a question of he either deliberately stuck his studs in our man’s face or it was a complete accident.
It looks to me that he didn’t make much effort to avoid Oliviera, you would have think instinctively you’d hold your foot back, take a fall, do anything to avoid what would inevitably be a nasty injury (Oliviera was fractions away from losing an eye).
These days the thinking is much more that players are responsible for their actions. Once upon a time you could get away with horrendous challenges if you managed to get a slight touch of the ball, that is no less longer an excuse.

[RoyalBlue]

Ejaria 3 - a Sone Aluko 17/18 performance, drifted inside and kept losing the ball, very disappointed

You have to be kidding me! Battled throughout the game, never stopped running, frequently won challenges, wasn't afraid to go into challenges where many would have held back, more often than not the ball stuck to his feet like glue as he weaved past/between several players (love the spin that he produces to get out of tight situations) and produced some good passes. Yes, on occasions passes didn't come off but that's always going to happen when players are trying to be creative. One of my contenders for MOM. I think he was one of the local journos' choice as MOM?

Just shows how differently people can see a game/players.

[RoyalBlue]

Can't believe anyone can see that as anything other than deliberate. The guilt may have hit him immediately afterwards once he saw the severity of what he'd done but he was looking down at Oliveira whilst he did it.

Try watching it a full speed rather than slowed down to suit your story. In real time it's nowhere near as clear as you're making out. You have no idea if it was intentional or not, only Mings knows that answer.

I'm pretty damn sure the action was deliberate but also pretty damn sure the consequences weren't intended. However, that's a bit like a drunk driver claiming he didn't intend to injure anyone!

[RoyalBlue]

Really can`t recall the fee times Martinez nearly cost us, didn`t make a single mistake that I recall. I think JMW is on hos own there.

Indecision. Could have commanded his box better. Also played the ball long. Rather than tippy tappy around the box.

When was he supposed to have commanded his box better? No sane keeper would come charging out to the edge of his area when his defender is closest to the ball and has plenty of time to decide whether to clear into row Z or come home. Also produced a couple of strong punches clear when under pressure.

He did play long when needed! He did exactly what Stam, Clement and Gomes have all said they want the keeper to do i.e. make his own decision as to whether to play short or hit long. Quite a few occasions he went long and, better still, found his own man. Likewise when he had the ball in his hands (we should've scored with the opportunity he created in the first half with his great quick drop kick), and when he took goal kicks. Some great saves and he also did really well when defender (Yiadom?) skied that clearance in the wrong direction in the first half - went towards player with ball, stood big then quickly got back into position when another defender moved in to cover.

[RoyalBlue]

Richards : Why ? A total experiment in our dire circumstances. Surely it had to be Macca or Barrow ?

Defensively better option. Stop Hutton's runs. No bad offensively either. Gomes might see him potentially as a winger in the longer term..........

Not least gives him some game time. Both Macca or Barrow will be gone in the summer. Irrespective of which league we are in.

We do agree on this. Seemed a very sensible substitution, verified by the fact that Dim Tellor absolutely hated it. Barrow does not do defending so every time we lost the ball we would have been a man light down that side when Villa were already all over us!

[RoyalBlue]

Like the Zlatan one it’s incredibly difficult to tell if there was any intention

I do think he could have at the very least made more of an effort not to land on his face like that though

It's very tough to say if it was deliberate or not, only Mings will know for sure. What I'd say is if Oliveira didn't have the horrific injury nobody would be giving it a second thought. Because it is a nasty wound it clouds the judgement of many into automatically thinking it's a deliberate act. Also if the roles were reversed we'd be defending Oliveira vehemently and calling it an accident so we have to take our supporter caps off for a minute and just wait and see what happens in terms of FA investigation, I believe they will look at it.

The on field referee gave nothing and called it an accident, his angle was bad though and probably didn't see the contact. Assistant referee who had a better angle also didn't deem it a violent conduct incident.

But both the officials you mentioned were absolutely shyte. The East Stand Assistant referee provided absolutely zero assistance to his utterly crap colleague throughout the game.

[Nameless]

You have to be impressed that while apparently the ref didn’t see the contact he still decided it was sccidental. Presumably thanks to having the benefit of the bad angle !
Probably the fairest conclusion is that the officials just didn’t see what happened so couldn’t draw any conclusions either way.

[Snowflake Royal]

Can't believe anyone can see that as anything other than deliberate. The guilt may have hit him immediately afterwards once he saw the severity of what he'd done but he was looking down at Oliveira whilst he did it.

That's basically the same argument as the Hunt - Czech incident. It didn't wash then and it isn't conclusive now.

When you're stumbling and in a collision you look down. It doesn't mean you can change where you put your feet (or knee) in an instant.

You can lean one way or the other of course, its ambiguous, but anyone who tells you it's definitely deliberate or definitely accidental isn't someone whose judgement you want to rely on.

[Zip]

Really can`t recall the fee times Martinez nearly cost us, didn`t make a single mistake that I recall. I think JMW is on hos own there.

Indecision. Could have commanded his box better. Also played the ball long. Rather than tippy tappy around the box.

When was he supposed to have commanded his box better? No sane keeper would come charging out to the edge of his area when his defender is closest to the ball and has plenty of time to decide whether to clear into row Z or come home. Also produced a couple of strong punches clear when under pressure.

He did play long when needed! He did exactly what Stam, Clement and Gomes have all said they want the keeper to do i.e. make his own decision as to whether to play short or hit long. Quite a few occasions he went long and, better still, found his own man. Likewise when he had the ball in his hands (we should've scored with the opportunity he created in the first half with his great quick drop kick), and when he took goal kicks. Some great saves and he also did really well when defender (Yiadom?) skied that clearance in the wrong direction in the first half - went towards player with ball, stood big then quickly got back into position when another defender moved in to cover.

He was my MoTM followed by Ejaria and Miazga. My only criticism was he could have done better from the corner where Elphick won the header and hit the bar.

[Hound]

Can't believe anyone can see that as anything other than deliberate. The guilt may have hit him immediately afterwards once he saw the severity of what he'd done but he was looking down at Oliveira whilst he did it.

That's basically the same argument as the Hunt - Czech incident. It didn't wash then and it isn't conclusive now.

When you're stumbling and in a collision you look down. It doesn't mean you can change where you put your feet (or knee) in an instant.

You can lean one way or the other of course, its ambiguous, but anyone who tells you it's definitely deliberate or definitely accidental isn't someone whose judgement you want to rely on.

On balance after watching it any number of times, I’m about 80% certain he purposefully did do the stamp. There something unnatural about how he has bent his knee and kind of drags his leg behind him. Strikes an absolute dead hit as well

Obvs only he knows, and doubt the FA will punish him though