Squad for 2020/21

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Nameless » 30 Jul 2020 08:21

Old Man Andrews
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NewCorkSeth Tis a mystery who he knows in the club. Very intimate knowledge of comings and goings too.


Except Was it last summer we offered Moore a new deal to stop him going to Brighton ? And was it £15 million

And why would we be talking to Liverpool about Ejaria’s wages ? What we pay him Is nothing to do with them once he is a Reading player

You can sometimes make arrangements with the selling club for them to cover some of the players wages, normally in the form of a reduction to the agreed fee.

My guess is we are trying to haggle Liverpool down sighting Coronavirus making the agreed price no longer viable for us. We would argue that no other club would pay £3.5m in the current climate either and negotiate a more affordable deal. The saving we'd make would then go to pay his wages.


Can a club really continue to pay the wages of a player after they have sold him ? That sounds very dodgy ! Imagine if you sold a player to a team you then played and were still paying half his wages...
If we are just looking to reduce the fee by £500k to cover part of his wages that’s different but in that case it’s not a discussion about his wages We wouldn’t discussed what wages he would be onwith Liverpool when we did the original deal
Minor point I guess but it just sounds unlikely. I may be wrong !

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 30 Jul 2020 08:25

Nameless
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Except Was it last summer we offered Moore a new deal to stop him going to Brighton ? And was it £15 million

And why would we be talking to Liverpool about Ejaria’s wages ? What we pay him Is nothing to do with them once he is a Reading player

You can sometimes make arrangements with the selling club for them to cover some of the players wages, normally in the form of a reduction to the agreed fee.

My guess is we are trying to haggle Liverpool down sighting Coronavirus making the agreed price no longer viable for us. We would argue that no other club would pay £3.5m in the current climate either and negotiate a more affordable deal. The saving we'd make would then go to pay his wages.


Can a club really continue to pay the wages of a player after they have sold him ? That sounds very dodgy ! Imagine if you sold a player to a team you then played and were still paying half his wages...
If we are just looking to reduce the fee by £500k to cover part of his wages that’s different but in that case it’s not a discussion about his wages We wouldn’t discussed what wages he would be onwith Liverpool when we did the original deal
Minor point I guess but it just sounds unlikely. I may be wrong !

I think its not that uncommon actually. Usually a team will offer to pay a certain percentage of the players wages up until the point their contract with the selling club would have been up.

Clubs do it to shift high earners who the clubs that actually want him cant afford.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Old Man Andrews » 30 Jul 2020 08:26

Nameless
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Except Was it last summer we offered Moore a new deal to stop him going to Brighton ? And was it £15 million

And why would we be talking to Liverpool about Ejaria’s wages ? What we pay him Is nothing to do with them once he is a Reading player

You can sometimes make arrangements with the selling club for them to cover some of the players wages, normally in the form of a reduction to the agreed fee.

My guess is we are trying to haggle Liverpool down sighting Coronavirus making the agreed price no longer viable for us. We would argue that no other club would pay £3.5m in the current climate either and negotiate a more affordable deal. The saving we'd make would then go to pay his wages.


Can a club really continue to pay the wages of a player after they have sold him ? That sounds very dodgy ! Imagine if you sold a player to a team you then played and were still paying half his wages...
If we are just looking to reduce the fee by £500k to cover part of his wages that’s different but in that case it’s not a discussion about his wages We wouldn’t discussed what wages he would be onwith Liverpool when we did the original deal
Minor point I guess but it just sounds unlikely. I may be wrong !

Think it is fairly common for selling clubs to assist with paying towards a players wages once sold, especially the bigger clubs with high earners they want rid of. An example of this would be Mesut Ozil at Arsenal. They clearly want rid but no other club on the planet are going to pay Ozil anywhere near his Arsenal wage so Arsenal would pay a percentage of his wages just to get him off their books. I believe Real Madrid offered the same arrangement to clubs with Gareth Bale last summer.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by SouthDownsRoyal » 30 Jul 2020 08:41

Old Man Andrews
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Old Man Andrews You can sometimes make arrangements with the selling club for them to cover some of the players wages, normally in the form of a reduction to the agreed fee.

My guess is we are trying to haggle Liverpool down sighting Coronavirus making the agreed price no longer viable for us. We would argue that no other club would pay £3.5m in the current climate either and negotiate a more affordable deal. The saving we'd make would then go to pay his wages.


Can a club really continue to pay the wages of a player after they have sold him ? That sounds very dodgy ! Imagine if you sold a player to a team you then played and were still paying half his wages...
If we are just looking to reduce the fee by £500k to cover part of his wages that’s different but in that case it’s not a discussion about his wages We wouldn’t discussed what wages he would be onwith Liverpool when we did the original deal
Minor point I guess but it just sounds unlikely. I may be wrong !

Think it is fairly common for selling clubs to assist with paying towards a players wages once sold, especially the bigger clubs with high earners they want rid of. An example of this would be Mesut Ozil at Arsenal. They clearly want rid but no other club on the planet are going to pay Ozil anywhere near his Arsenal wage so Arsenal would pay a percentage of his wages just to get him off their books. I believe Real Madrid offered the same arrangement to clubs with Gareth Bale last summer.


What a crazy situation!

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Stranded » 30 Jul 2020 08:49

Old Man Andrews
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NewCorkSeth Tis a mystery who he knows in the club. Very intimate knowledge of comings and goings too.


Except Was it last summer we offered Moore a new deal to stop him going to Brighton ? And was it £15 million

And why would we be talking to Liverpool about Ejaria’s wages ? What we pay him Is nothing to do with them once he is a Reading player

You can sometimes make arrangements with the selling club for them to cover some of the players wages, normally in the form of a reduction to the agreed fee.

My guess is we are trying to haggle Liverpool down sighting Coronavirus making the agreed price no longer viable for us. We would argue that no other club would pay £3.5m in the current climate either and negotiate a more affordable deal. The saving we'd make would then go to pay his wages.


Think if talking to Liverpool we may be saying, we can now only pay you 2.5m for him due to circumstances. If they say yes then the saved 1m helps cover the original offer to Ejaria without it "costing" us that amount.

Or even can we just restructure the payments to Liverpool to make the deal affordable.


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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Lower West » 30 Jul 2020 10:11

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Except Was it last summer we offered Moore a new deal to stop him going to Brighton ? And was it £15 million

And why would we be talking to Liverpool about Ejaria’s wages ? What we pay him Is nothing to do with them once he is a Reading player

You can sometimes make arrangements with the selling club for them to cover some of the players wages, normally in the form of a reduction to the agreed fee.

My guess is we are trying to haggle Liverpool down sighting Coronavirus making the agreed price no longer viable for us. We would argue that no other club would pay £3.5m in the current climate either and negotiate a more affordable deal. The saving we'd make would then go to pay his wages.


Think if talking to Liverpool we may be saying, we can now only pay you 2.5m for him due to circumstances. If they say yes then the saved 1m helps cover the original offer to Ejaria without it "costing" us that amount.

Or even can we just restructure the payments to Liverpool to make the deal affordable.


With greatly reduced income all football clubs are going to have to be more flexible. During the lockdown Arsenal were reportedly losing £25 million a month. A few hundred thousand to Liverpool is nothing compared to the income shortfall they've also suffered.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 30 Jul 2020 10:17

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Old Man Andrews You can sometimes make arrangements with the selling club for them to cover some of the players wages, normally in the form of a reduction to the agreed fee.

My guess is we are trying to haggle Liverpool down sighting Coronavirus making the agreed price no longer viable for us. We would argue that no other club would pay £3.5m in the current climate either and negotiate a more affordable deal. The saving we'd make would then go to pay his wages.


Think if talking to Liverpool we may be saying, we can now only pay you 2.5m for him due to circumstances. If they say yes then the saved 1m helps cover the original offer to Ejaria without it "costing" us that amount.

Or even can we just restructure the payments to Liverpool to make the deal affordable.


With greatly reduced income all football clubs are going to have to be more flexible. During the lockdown Arsenal were reportedly losing £25 million a month. A few hundred thousand to Liverpool is nothing compared to the income shortfall they've also suffered.

25 million a month! Wow.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Snowflake Royal » 30 Jul 2020 10:50

How?! They didn't have to give back all the TV money and there's no way they make that from ticket and hospitalituly in 2 or 3 games

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 30 Jul 2020 11:08

Snowflake Royal How?! They didn't have to give back all the TV money and there's no way they make that from ticket and hospitalituly in 2 or 3 games

This is how I should have reacted. However a quick search shows 24.33% of Arsenals revenue comes from matchday income, 96.2 million last season, so they certainly have cause for worry despite it not being 25 million a month.


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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by royalp-we » 30 Jul 2020 23:19

Is it really down to the transfer fee that we have hit a stumbling block? What I’ve heard is that we are renegotiating terms with Ejaria.

We were offering silly wages last summer, it wouldn’t surprise me if we have a self imposed wage cap for new signings now.

Very likely that it wouldn’t go down well signing the guy from Shrewsbury and offer him X amount; 2 or 3 years his senior; and at the same time you activate a contract for Ejaria at 2 or 3 times more p/w

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 31 Jul 2020 08:20

Can we acknowledge that if we did indeed offer silly wages last summer it was likely Mark Bowen who offered those silly wages.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Nameless » 31 Jul 2020 08:27

NewCorkSeth Can we acknowledge that if we did indeed offer silly wages last summer it was likely Mark Bowen who offered those silly wages.


Not knowing what his brief as DofF was it is hard to tell.
He’s probably have been party to any discussions but probably not responsible for setting the budget for the deal.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 31 Jul 2020 08:29

Nameless
NewCorkSeth Can we acknowledge that if we did indeed offer silly wages last summer it was likely Mark Bowen who offered those silly wages.


Not knowing what his brief as DofF was it is hard to tell.
He’s probably have been party to any discussions but probably not responsible for setting the budget for the deal.

So Howe then? It has to have been somebody still at the club.


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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Nameless » 31 Jul 2020 08:36

NewCorkSeth
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NewCorkSeth Can we acknowledge that if we did indeed offer silly wages last summer it was likely Mark Bowen who offered those silly wages.


Not knowing what his brief as DofF was it is hard to tell.
He’s probably have been party to any discussions but probably not responsible for setting the budget for the deal.

So Howe then? It has to have been somebody still at the club.


OF course, but we don’t really know what the decision making process is so putting a name to it is difficult. It could have been Dai Yongge who said ‘we’ll pay him £10k a week’. What sounded a good deal a year ago probably sounds very different now with no income coming in. Loads of businesses are renegotiating contracts and slashing expenses.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by From Despair To Where? » 31 Jul 2020 09:00

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NewCorkSeth Can we acknowledge that if we did indeed offer silly wages last summer it was likely Mark Bowen who offered those silly wages.


Not knowing what his brief as DofF was it is hard to tell.
He’s probably have been party to any discussions but probably not responsible for setting the budget for the deal.


I remember an interview with Bowen last year when he was DoF where he said his role was to look at every aspect of the day to day running of the football club to see what could be improved. It seemed to be more of an analyst role and he was originally brought in on a consultancy basis so I doubt he had too much input into the nuts and bolts of transfer policy.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 31 Jul 2020 09:29

Nameless
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Not knowing what his brief as DofF was it is hard to tell.
He’s probably have been party to any discussions but probably not responsible for setting the budget for the deal.

So Howe then? It has to have been somebody still at the club.


OF course, but we don’t really know what the decision making process is so putting a name to it is difficult. It could have been Dai Yongge who said ‘we’ll pay him £10k a week’. What sounded a good deal a year ago probably sounds very different now with no income coming in. Loads of businesses are renegotiating contracts and slashing expenses.

I reckon we can rule out Dai Yongge. My point was that someone at the club, knowing that last season we spent two times our income on wages, offered a deal that is apparently now too expensive. That doesn't give me much hope.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Simon's Church » 31 Jul 2020 10:13

NewCorkSeth
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NewCorkSeth So Howe then? It has to have been somebody still at the club.


OF course, but we don’t really know what the decision making process is so putting a name to it is difficult. It could have been Dai Yongge who said ‘we’ll pay him £10k a week’. What sounded a good deal a year ago probably sounds very different now with no income coming in. Loads of businesses are renegotiating contracts and slashing expenses.

I reckon we can rule out Dai Yongge. My point was that someone at the club, knowing that last season we spent two times our income on wages, offered a deal that is apparently now too expensive. That doesn't give me much hope.


We tried the same thing with Glenn murray didnt we? Before he ended up back at Brighton and got them promoted.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Notts Royal » 31 Jul 2020 10:19

NewCorkSeth
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NewCorkSeth So Howe then? It has to have been somebody still at the club.


OF course, but we don’t really know what the decision making process is so putting a name to it is difficult. It could have been Dai Yongge who said ‘we’ll pay him £10k a week’. What sounded a good deal a year ago probably sounds very different now with no income coming in. Loads of businesses are renegotiating contracts and slashing expenses.

I reckon we can rule out Dai Yongge. My point was that someone at the club, knowing that last season we spent two times our income on wages, offered a deal that is apparently now too expensive. That doesn't give me much hope.


I’d recommend listening to the Brian Tevreden podcast; a real insight into the intricacies of transfers/offering contracts etc. It’s rarely as simple as saying it’s one person etc

Simple fact is the post-COVID climate is different to before & every club will have to offer lower wages. We might impose a self-imposed salary cap but remember the EFL are planning on introducing a league-wide salary cap too

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 31 Jul 2020 10:29

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OF course, but we don’t really know what the decision making process is so putting a name to it is difficult. It could have been Dai Yongge who said ‘we’ll pay him £10k a week’. What sounded a good deal a year ago probably sounds very different now with no income coming in. Loads of businesses are renegotiating contracts and slashing expenses.

I reckon we can rule out Dai Yongge. My point was that someone at the club, knowing that last season we spent two times our income on wages, offered a deal that is apparently now too expensive. That doesn't give me much hope.


I’d recommend listening to the Brian Tevreden podcast; a real insight into the intricacies of transfers/offering contracts etc. It’s rarely as simple as saying it’s one person etc

Simple fact is the post-COVID climate is different to before & every club will have to offer lower wages. We might impose a self-imposed salary cap but remember the EFL are planning on introducing a league-wide salary cap too

I did listen to it. Someone at the club authorised the deal to go ahead despite our financial issues which, according to many on here, has not been drastically changed by the release of 12 odd first team players. So what has changed since then? We don't have a new DoF so maybe Howe has taken sole responsibility for contract negotiations but I would find it very odd if someone else had final say on contracts and transfers previously. If it was the owners then they would surely have just stepped in again and said to sign him.

If we are imposing a new salary cap, which we should, we need to ship out a lot more than just Swift and Moore and, if we do sell Swift, that leaves us with Rinomhota, Olise, new signing Laurent and maybe East and Holsgrove. We will need to sign a CM anyway. To find a player of Ejarias quality and potential at that price is no simple task. I mean, thats 80 odd Championship apps between 5 players without Ejaria.

If the contract for Ovie is that ludicrous that it puts us over some fantasy salary cap then how are we confident that those in charge of transfers in the club have any idea what they are doing?

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Snowflake Royal » 31 Jul 2020 10:33

NewCorkSeth
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NewCorkSeth So Howe then? It has to have been somebody still at the club.


OF course, but we don’t really know what the decision making process is so putting a name to it is difficult. It could have been Dai Yongge who said ‘we’ll pay him £10k a week’. What sounded a good deal a year ago probably sounds very different now with no income coming in. Loads of businesses are renegotiating contracts and slashing expenses.

I reckon we can rule out Dai Yongge. My point was that someone at the club, knowing that last season we spent two times our income on wages, offered a deal that is apparently now too expensive. That doesn't give me much hope.



You can't rule out the owner at all. Howe may well recommend budgets, but the owner could be active and say, no, I want that player, pay what it takes.

Equally Howe has been in charge when we've overspend on shite before - while SJM was in East Asia and Burns was spunking money on Scottish shite.

The DoF, whatever the role, shouldn't be able to just pay out whatever he wants. So it's probably above that pay grade and doesn't seem to have been about Bowen's role anyway.

So it's likely Howe or Dai.

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