Squad Watch 2022/23

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Stranded
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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by Stranded » 28 Jun 2022 11:42

NathStPaul
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Yes.


Guess that’s why they are in their jobs and you are in yours then

Yeah they have done a cracking job of recruitment in recent times, solid work at the club. Oh and be an arse all you like, doesn't make you any less wrong.


We have a brand new recruitment team and do not seem to be relying on Kia anymore, that may well have passed you by. Unless Bowen, Carey and Ince are dertermined to continue to be shit at recruitment as that is the clubs MO these days, then what we did before this summer is irrelevant in terms of new additions (bar it restraining what we can do).

I'm pretty sure that the club are talking to multiple targets but the process will be something like this for each one.

1. Identify target
2. Approach agent of target and make an offer or club first if a loan deal.
3. Agent and player consider offer alongside any other offers.
4. Player accepts, negotiates or rejects offer.
5. If accepted, details of offer go to the EFL for the 3 stage review we currently have to go through to ensure we are meeting the restrictions.
6. If OK'd by EFL, player signs.
7. Announce player.

Now for a player like Bouzandis, this could probably be done in a few days as wages will be low etc but for deals for midfielders etc, who may also be more in demand - we lose all control of the process from step 3 to step 6.

For example, we may have identified a midfielder who is out of contract at a fellow Champ side - we think he'll fit and make a decent based on our circumstances. This offer was made on 1st June. Player is on holiday but on returning on say 15th June, he and his agent agree that this would be a good move for his career and the money side is fine. Great.

Same day, we send off all the info to the EFL but we have yet to have it OK'd as there are some points of clarity needed or they may even say - "No, sorry you can't pay X, you need to lower that offer", so we have to negotiate again with the player and start with the EFL again - so very possible that a deal that was identified 4 weeks ago is still inching towards the line.

If it is a loan, we have the added difficulty of having to negotiate with the players club to get them to release the player for nothing, which some will be happy to do but only at X point - so we may have a couple of loans lined up but they aren't allowed to come until they have had a week or two training with their parent club first.

So you can get pissy about who we sign and in the order we sign them but due to the mess we have got ourselves in, we simply have close to zero control over the process now.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by Stranded » 28 Jun 2022 11:43

Snowflake Royal It wasn’t a priority area.


It was if Southwood isn't rated and the feeling is the younger keepers need loan time at L1 or L2 level,

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PATRIQT
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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by PATRIQT » 28 Jun 2022 11:44

The more I think of this new keeper, the more it makes less sense. He's cover, and nowhere near good enough to start. So why not give CBC the place on the bench and a season training with the first-team, or Andresson? Just feels totally unnecessary.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by YorkshireRoyal99 » 28 Jun 2022 11:50

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You seemed to have forgotten most contracts run intil June 30th so I am sure the powers-that-be have some irons in the fire for Thursday.
It is very true we need a LB and some midfielders, but watch this space!


Which is exactly what some people are forgetting, not to mention there is still 2 months of a transfer window to happen yet where players may become available at different times.

People seem to think it should all just happen before pre-season starts or the season, when that just isn't the reality of the situation we are faced with. Not just us, but every club.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by morganb » 28 Jun 2022 12:07

Wout Weghorst's Burnley exit is set to be confirmed in the coming days with the striker expected to sign for Besiktas.


Wonder what impact this will have in their interest in Joao?


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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by YorkshireRoyal99 » 28 Jun 2022 12:20

morganb
Wout Weghorst's Burnley exit is set to be confirmed in the coming days with the striker expected to sign for Besiktas.


Wonder what impact this will have in their interest in Joao?


It probably just opens the door wide open for Watford to come in by the sounds of it.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by Wycombe Royal » 28 Jun 2022 12:48

PATRIQT and nowhere near good enough to start.

Based on your in depth knowledge of his career and your viewing of his games for Sutton I presume?

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by Snowflake Royal » 28 Jun 2022 13:00

YorkshireRoyal99
Snowflake Royal Also enjoying being told we have 2 months to make signings. Like the first month isn't our entire pre-season and the second isn’t about a 5th of the actual season.

Probably best to not get a 5th of the way into the season with no senior midfield or LB.


So what are you expecting exactly? We make all of our signings to exactly how it would work ideally for ourselves as a club? I don't think you understand the practical element of how difficult the transfer market actually is.

Think it's pretty clear that what I expect is us to target our priorities and use our resources as efficiently as possible. And not scapegoat or ignore decent young players.

I'd be perfectly happy to accept the club doing things differently and trust them if they had any record of getting it right. Rather than a record of getting it consistently wrong.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by From Despair To Where? » 28 Jun 2022 13:03

The thing with Southwood is that if we were linked with a 24 year old keeper from another club with barely a season's playing experience at EFL level, who's prone to the odd clanger or 2, I'm fairly sure the almost unanimous opinion would be "not good enough"


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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by Snowflake Royal » 28 Jun 2022 13:03

YorkshireRoyal99
9165 Lads
You seemed to have forgotten most contracts run intil June 30th so I am sure the powers-that-be have some irons in the fire for Thursday.
It is very true we need a LB and some midfielders, but watch this space!


Which is exactly what some people are forgetting, not to mention there is still 2 months of a transfer window to happen yet where players may become available at different times.

People seem to think it should all just happen before pre-season starts or the season, when that just isn't the reality of the situation we are faced with. Not just us, but every club.

No one is forgetting it. Because we all know the date that contracts expire is completely irrelevent to when you can agree a signing. And we're aware that the season starts in a month and we're currently in a rather crucial pre-season.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by URZZZZ » 28 Jun 2022 13:06

Hound Ince has clearly made his mind up on Southwood. Brining in Hein and then Nyland over him tells you all you need to know there. He’ll be shipped out asap, sure we can find him a loan if not on a free.

CBC and Andresson are progressing nicely and hopefully an option from next season onwards if they can get further experience this year. Lumley only on loan so unless he excels he won’t stay


Was Paunovic who brought in Hein to the team tbf but yeah, it’s clear he doesn’t rate him

Think Southwood has been given the short end of the stick slightly and used as a scapegoat by management but on the other hand, I don’t mind managers making cut throat decisions, they are the ones who see the players almost every day so have more of an idea

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by Hendo » 28 Jun 2022 13:20

From Despair To Where? The thing with Southwood is that if we were linked with a 24 year old keeper from another club with barely a season's playing experience at EFL level, who's prone to the odd clanger or 2, I'm fairly sure the almost unanimous opinion would be "not good enough"


Agreed.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by NewCorkSeth » 28 Jun 2022 13:30

How did we react to signing Bond? Similar thing wasn't it?


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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by YorkshireRoyal99 » 28 Jun 2022 13:32

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You seemed to have forgotten most contracts run intil June 30th so I am sure the powers-that-be have some irons in the fire for Thursday.
It is very true we need a LB and some midfielders, but watch this space!


Which is exactly what some people are forgetting, not to mention there is still 2 months of a transfer window to happen yet where players may become available at different times.

People seem to think it should all just happen before pre-season starts or the season, when that just isn't the reality of the situation we are faced with. Not just us, but every club.

No one is forgetting it. Because we all know the date that contracts expire is completely irrelevent to when you can agree a signing. And we're aware that the season starts in a month and we're currently in a rather crucial pre-season.


Yes but you can't sign players that aren't available just because we are in a crucial pre-season and the season starts in a month. Some deals may happen on deadline day, yes far from ideal, but that's the reality of the situation. Other clubs in our league may be buying from overseas who are not prepared to sell/loan players out yet, which then affects if we want x player from y club. I wish it would work in an ideal world like you're describing, but it just won't, particularly given our situation at the moment.

Some players will be negotiating contracts with their current clubs and may not be open to discussing with other clubs until their contract has expired, yes not true in every case, but it isn't just going to happen all at once.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by YorkshireRoyal99 » 28 Jun 2022 13:55

Snowflake Royal
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Snowflake Royal Also enjoying being told we have 2 months to make signings. Like the first month isn't our entire pre-season and the second isn’t about a 5th of the actual season.

Probably best to not get a 5th of the way into the season with no senior midfield or LB.


So what are you expecting exactly? We make all of our signings to exactly how it would work ideally for ourselves as a club? I don't think you understand the practical element of how difficult the transfer market actually is.

Think it's pretty clear that what I expect is us to target our priorities and use our resources as efficiently as possible. And not scapegoat or ignore decent young players.

I'd be perfectly happy to accept the club doing things differently and trust them if they had any record of getting it right. Rather than a record of getting it consistently wrong.


There is no evidence to suggest we are ignoring decent young players though. We are using our resources efficiently, we had 0 goalkeepers at the level the staff believed were good enough, so we have sorted that out now hopefully. We had numbers, but not quality at this moment in time.

The club now seem to be operating differently in the market though, based on who we have signed and who we have been linked with, which is surely a positive as we are looking to change our approach which has consistently been wrong. If this change still doesn't work, then fair enough, but you can't really judge without at least giving the recruitment team we have now an opportunity to rectify the issues.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by NathStPaul » 28 Jun 2022 13:58

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So what are you expecting exactly? We make all of our signings to exactly how it would work ideally for ourselves as a club? I don't think you understand the practical element of how difficult the transfer market actually is.

Think it's pretty clear that what I expect is us to target our priorities and use our resources as efficiently as possible. And not scapegoat or ignore decent young players.

I'd be perfectly happy to accept the club doing things differently and trust them if they had any record of getting it right. Rather than a record of getting it consistently wrong.


There is no evidence to suggest we are ignoring decent young players though. We are using our resources efficiently, we had 0 goalkeepers at the level the staff believed were good enough, so we have sorted that out now hopefully. We had numbers, but not quality at this moment in time.

The club now seem to be operating differently in the market though, based on who we have signed and who we have been linked with, which is surely a positive as we are looking to change our approach which has consistently been wrong. If this change still doesn't work, then fair enough, but you can't really judge without at least giving the recruitment team we have now an opportunity to rectify the issues.

Is this "market" essentially players that nobody else wants who happen to be in Mark Bowen's phone contacts or relatives of the coaching staff?

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by YorkshireRoyal99 » 28 Jun 2022 14:26

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Snowflake Royal Think it's pretty clear that what I expect is us to target our priorities and use our resources as efficiently as possible. And not scapegoat or ignore decent young players.

I'd be perfectly happy to accept the club doing things differently and trust them if they had any record of getting it right. Rather than a record of getting it consistently wrong.


There is no evidence to suggest we are ignoring decent young players though. We are using our resources efficiently, we had 0 goalkeepers at the level the staff believed were good enough, so we have sorted that out now hopefully. We had numbers, but not quality at this moment in time.

The club now seem to be operating differently in the market though, based on who we have signed and who we have been linked with, which is surely a positive as we are looking to change our approach which has consistently been wrong. If this change still doesn't work, then fair enough, but you can't really judge without at least giving the recruitment team we have now an opportunity to rectify the issues.

Is this "market" essentially players that nobody else wants who happen to be in Mark Bowen's phone contacts or relatives of the coaching staff?


Well that's normally how it works, a DoF should have contacts in the game who may be useful for a club and, as I've said on a separate thread I believe, I wouldn't say it's negative for us to use other methods to bring in players who are deemed good enough given how restricted we are in this market as well.

I don't think it's a case of players that nobody else wants though. We aren't the most attractive option in the Championship, but that is the same for 22 other clubs as well. We can be competitive enough given what we can offer, but we are just pulling in players who are operating at a level that we are expected to be next season, towards the bottom.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by Hound » 28 Jun 2022 14:27

Or maybe we’re just picking the low hanging fruit that the coaches etc know and have been in contact with early doors

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by Snowflake Royal » 28 Jun 2022 14:34

YorkshireRoyal99
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So what are you expecting exactly? We make all of our signings to exactly how it would work ideally for ourselves as a club? I don't think you understand the practical element of how difficult the transfer market actually is.

Think it's pretty clear that what I expect is us to target our priorities and use our resources as efficiently as possible. And not scapegoat or ignore decent young players.

I'd be perfectly happy to accept the club doing things differently and trust them if they had any record of getting it right. Rather than a record of getting it consistently wrong.


There is no evidence to suggest we are ignoring decent young players though. We are using our resources efficiently, we had 0 goalkeepers at the level the staff believed were good enough, so we have sorted that out now hopefully. We had numbers, but not quality at this moment in time.

The club now seem to be operating differently in the market though, based on who we have signed and who we have been linked with, which is surely a positive as we are looking to change our approach which has consistently been wrong. If this change still doesn't work, then fair enough, but you can't really judge without at least giving the recruitment team we have now an opportunity to rectify the issues.

:| Southwood and Andresson.

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Re: Squad Watch 2022/23

by Hendo » 28 Jun 2022 14:42

Snowflake Royal
YorkshireRoyal99
Snowflake Royal Think it's pretty clear that what I expect is us to target our priorities and use our resources as efficiently as possible. And not scapegoat or ignore decent young players.

I'd be perfectly happy to accept the club doing things differently and trust them if they had any record of getting it right. Rather than a record of getting it consistently wrong.


There is no evidence to suggest we are ignoring decent young players though. We are using our resources efficiently, we had 0 goalkeepers at the level the staff believed were good enough, so we have sorted that out now hopefully. We had numbers, but not quality at this moment in time.

The club now seem to be operating differently in the market though, based on who we have signed and who we have been linked with, which is surely a positive as we are looking to change our approach which has consistently been wrong. If this change still doesn't work, then fair enough, but you can't really judge without at least giving the recruitment team we have now an opportunity to rectify the issues.

:| Southwood and Andresson.


Southwood has been deemed not good enough by the staff and thus has been told he can leave - should be excluded from conversations currently as he doesn't feature in first team plans. Whether that is right or wrong, that is the decision which has been made and someone needed to be bought in to replace him.

Andresson may be good enough, but he is a young kid who hasn't played above League 1 yet - Virginia was the 'keeper last time we played someone that young in goal and look how that turned out. I'd much rather a 31 year old play in goal over a 20 year old who has similar experience.

I'd be much more comfortable Andresson going out on loan to another L1 club, getting another years experience under his belt in a better position the following season.

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