MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by RoyalBlue » 09 Nov 2022 09:48

Royal Rother
Zip
Snowflake Royal :lol: if you call falling on his arse creative. When has he ever made more than 5 assists in a season? Never. In 127 appearances for us.


.I'm afraid to coming around to this point of view too Always backed Ovie but he had to produce the goods this season and has been very poor.


As I said the other day, it looks to me like Ejaria has been told to cut out the tricks and become more of a “normal” footballer.

Trouble is, that’s his MO, take that away from him and there’s nothing much left by the looks of it. So he just goes backwards. Massive shame because he had something that people would pay to watch.


Absolutely spot on. He's been made a shadow of his former self. I used to get excited every time he got the ball; no longer as all the tricks and skill that created opportunities for himself and others have disappeared.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by RoyalBlue » 09 Nov 2022 09:52

YorkshireRoyal99 I didn't actually think, collectively, the team played all that badly. We were all over the place in the opening 15-20 minutes, but got hold of the ball, regained some composure and looked threatening. Of course, some individuals produced worse games/moments than others, Rahman with the ball was poor (although thought he defended quite well personally for the 2 penalty shouts) and Ejaria had a poor game on the whole. But the team performance didn't lack spirit, it just lacked quality in the final third and a real cutting edge.

Unfortunately, this lack of a cutting edge in the final third is becoming a common theme now and something that we do need to address urgently as we are slipping towards having the worst attack in the league (only a few teams have scored fewer I think). Whether it's down to a lack of confidence, lack of cohesion etc, only the staff should know but it needs addressing for the Hull game and then a good solid couple of weeks on the training ground during the WC break.

Seen criticisms of the subs but I'm not sure how I feel about it personally. I can see the game plan, stay in the game until the 80th minute and go for it in the final 10 and obviously that's where we've conceded the second goal which has killed the game. There was a plan there, whether we could have done it earlier is up for debate. At the moment, it's just a sticky spell and we would benefit from the WC break, getting players back on the training field and having returned to fitness and then going again really. We could definitely be worse off than we are.


Trouble is, the moment we get players on the training pitch we seem to injure them. It seems absurd to me that McIntyre is yet another training casualty, having picked up a strain/pull in training. Was he still not warmed up properly? Are the players being pushed too hard in training, despite Ince constantly moaning about how fatigued the schedule has made them? What happened to the extra stretching and yoga that was going to be implemented to help prevent these pulls/strains?

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by RoyalBlue » 09 Nov 2022 09:54

Snowflake Royal
Royal_jimmy Considering Ince is left footed why does he keep playing on the right. Makes no sense to me.

So he can cut in and shoot. Wingers who hit the byline and cross are extinct.


Pretty sure I've seen some of that extinct species playing for our opponents.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by leon » 09 Nov 2022 09:59

RoyalBlue
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Royal_jimmy Considering Ince is left footed why does he keep playing on the right. Makes no sense to me.

So he can cut in and shoot. Wingers who hit the byline and cross are extinct.


Pretty sure I've seen some of that extinct species playing for our opponents.


Yeah I could have sworn that I've seen crosses into the box from both flanks this season. Must be a false memory.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by Royal Rother » 09 Nov 2022 10:19

We don't do anything quickly enough.

Nothing is instinctive.

When in possession we stop, look for a pass, and in that time everyone has been closed down so there are no easy balls. As a result, when we do pass forward, the guys on the end of the pass almost always seem to have their backs to goal with a defender right up their bum, so we either get dispossessed or pass backwards. Same applies with crosses, the ball is always too slow being delivered which means defenders are set and can challenge (if we actually get a clean delivery in without being charged down which isn't often).

Do things faster and maybe they'd have a couple of yards of space to utilise. To counter the low possession stats I wonder whether their heads have been filled with a "keep the ball" mantra which just ends up blunting everything we try to do and ends up having the reverse effect.

We are just so predictable. I don't want to see us giving the ball away unnecessarily but we need to take a few more risks with early deliveries to create a degree of uncertainty in the opposition. At the moment we are easy to play against.

Still, I suppose a reality check is reasonable. No idea how much Watford's squad cost but it's a hell of a lot more than ours. They just have better players. Maybe when we play teams more at our level we'll find things a bit easier. Maybe....


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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by bcubed » 09 Nov 2022 10:23

Kind of agree with YR99, although I may be looking for positives where there are none!

I have to say I felt we looked pretty positive especially at the start of the second half. More so than in recent games. And it actually looked like we could get back into the game. There were a few decent crosses at least.

We do look poor up front but how many good chances are we creating? Can't blame that all on the strikers

I don't think I've seen a productive performance from Tom Ince for a while now. When we were doing well he was playing well too. Don't really like him out wide. And when he gets the ball he is trying to do too much.

Hutch back is a big plus. He's just decisive where others dither.

Hopefully we can go again after the World Cup has been and gone.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by Snowball » 09 Nov 2022 10:42

7 of the last 9 games have been against
the current best sides in the league


1 Burnley Away L 2-1 in 94th minute (Basically robbed, could easily have won, deserved a draw
4 Norwich SOLID DRAW
5 Watford Away 2-0 Meh, dumb defensive error and another late goal
6 QPR Away Led, lost to 84th minute goal
7 Preston Lost 1-2 As some have said, shoulda been 0-0, was 1-1
8 Swansea Away Led 0-2, eventually Lost 3-2
9 Luton Away SOLID DRAW

GD 6-12

Considering that's seven games against the top 9, four games away
we have hardly been "pummled" and have been reasonably competitive

We've been let down by individual defensive errors and our strikers
are, at best, "off colour"

22 WBA.... poor defeat but they do have good players
20 Bristol WON

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by URZZZZZZZZ » 09 Nov 2022 10:50

The WC break can't come soon enough. Get some decent centre backs returning and I think we'll see an upturn in form at the restart.

A few take outs from yesterday:

Holmes was atrocious, a bad start to the game really seemed to take the stuffing out of him

Hutchinson does the basics flawlessly. It's great that he's returned and we'll be a better team with him in it

We are under utilising Long, which is criminal based on early season form

Subs brought on 5/10 minutes too late

The referee was truly abysmal, I always shudder when I see his name on the list

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by paultheroyal » 09 Nov 2022 11:13

Surprised at referee comments. Thought he was ok and in terms of decision making, we can have no gripes.


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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by CountryRoyal » 09 Nov 2022 11:39

Royal Rother We don't do anything quickly enough.

Nothing is instinctive.

When in possession we stop, look for a pass, and in that time everyone has been closed down so there are no easy balls. As a result, when we do pass forward, the guys on the end of the pass almost always seem to have their backs to goal with a defender right up their bum, so we either get dispossessed or pass backwards. Same applies with crosses, the ball is always too slow being delivered which means defenders are set and can challenge (if we actually get a clean delivery in without being charged down which isn't often).


It’s no wonder when you don’t have a settled team. Apart from the now generally settled back 3, Pince is constantly chopping and changing players and it doesn’t appear to be an in an overly methodical way. Yesterday we had players not seeing options, going the wrong way, running into trouble and then looking for an outlet. There was little cohesion at times which is indicative of this.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by Hendo » 09 Nov 2022 11:44

paultheroyal Surprised at referee comments. Thought he was ok and in terms of decision making, we can have no gripes.


Other than maybe not booking their captain for a few persistent fouls, also thought he was ok.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by 72 bus » 09 Nov 2022 11:47

URZZZZZZZZ The WC break can't come soon enough. Get some decent centre backs returning and I think we'll see an upturn in form at the restart.

A few take outs from yesterday:

Holmes was atrocious, a bad start to the game really seemed to take the stuffing out of him

Hutchinson does the basics flawlessly. It's great that he's returned and we'll be a better team with him in it

We are under utilising Long, which is criminal based on early season form

Subs brought on 5/10 minutes too late

The referee was truly abysmal, I always shudder when I see his name on the list


Under utilising Guinness Walker as well, Rahman is dreadful and offers nothing

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by Snowflake Royal » 09 Nov 2022 11:49

Hendo
paultheroyal Surprised at referee comments. Thought he was ok and in terms of decision making, we can have no gripes.


Other than maybe not booking their captain for a few persistent fouls, also thought he was ok.

Thought he got a lot wrong.

Pretty blatant pen for them. Smack in the chops for Holmes he was looking right at. The usual mix of letting a lot of contact go.

Thought there was a hint of hands from Rahman on the ground for another possible pen too, but missed the replay and it was far from clear.


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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by Royal Rother » 09 Nov 2022 11:53

I have no idea how long it impacts players, but I do wonder whether the lack of a proper pre-season for a number of our late incomers is proving a negative.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by windermereROYAL » 09 Nov 2022 11:53

Agree with CR there, quite a few times we had players on the ball running across field with an easy pass out wide only to turn back into trouble, even in commentary Goodman said that Tom Ince was running in behind but was ignored or not seen by his team mates.
Late in the game at 1-0 Meite got free own the left but went for glory and got crowded out instead of looking for options when Loum was screaming for a square pass, a minute later it was 2-0.
Players are just making the wrong decisions time and again.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by Royal Rother » 09 Nov 2022 11:56

Snowflake Royal
Hendo
paultheroyal Surprised at referee comments. Thought he was ok and in terms of decision making, we can have no gripes.


Other than maybe not booking their captain for a few persistent fouls, also thought he was ok.

Thought he got a lot wrong.

Pretty blatant pen for them. Smack in the chops for Holmes he was looking right at. The usual mix of letting a lot of contact go.

Thought there was a hint of hands from Rahman on the ground for another possible pen too, but missed the replay and it was far from clear.


Having first thought "that's a red card" after seeing the last replay I ended up thinking the smack in the chops was accidental. He was trying to free himself from Holmes' attention, and when his hand / arm broke free the momentum of suddenly having nothing holding him took his hand up into his face. Seriously.

But I'd have to see it again to check.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by paultheroyal » 09 Nov 2022 12:09

Snowflake Royal
Hendo
paultheroyal Surprised at referee comments. Thought he was ok and in terms of decision making, we can have no gripes.


Other than maybe not booking their captain for a few persistent fouls, also thought he was ok.

Thought he got a lot wrong.

Pretty blatant pen for them. Smack in the chops for Holmes he was looking right at. The usual mix of letting a lot of contact go.

Thought there was a hint of hands from Rahman on the ground for another possible pen too, but missed the replay and it was far from clear.


For clarity - wasnt a blatant penalty for them. Wasnt a smack, more of a flick and a poke, cancelled out by Holmes awful play acting. Letting a lot of contact go, although there was not much is a good thing right? No hands from Rahman - so other than that you pretty much nailed your post.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by Snowflake Royal » 09 Nov 2022 12:24

Royal Rother
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Hendo
Other than maybe not booking their captain for a few persistent fouls, also thought he was ok.

Thought he got a lot wrong.

Pretty blatant pen for them. Smack in the chops for Holmes he was looking right at. The usual mix of letting a lot of contact go.

Thought there was a hint of hands from Rahman on the ground for another possible pen too, but missed the replay and it was far from clear.


Having first thought "that's a red card" after seeing the last replay I ended up thinking the smack in the chops was accidental. He was trying to free himself from Holmes' attention, and when his hand / arm broke free the momentum of suddenly having nothing holding him took his hand up into his face. Seriously.

But I'd have to see it again to check.

I think he knew what he was doing. I missed whether he got a yellow, but he probably should have already had one so off either way imo.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by Stranded » 09 Nov 2022 12:33

Royal Rother We don't do anything quickly enough.

Nothing is instinctive.

When in possession we stop, look for a pass, and in that time everyone has been closed down so there are no easy balls. As a result, when we do pass forward, the guys on the end of the pass almost always seem to have their backs to goal with a defender right up their bum, so we either get dispossessed or pass backwards. Same applies with crosses, the ball is always too slow being delivered which means defenders are set and can challenge (if we actually get a clean delivery in without being charged down which isn't often).

Do things faster and maybe they'd have a couple of yards of space to utilise. To counter the low possession stats I wonder whether their heads have been filled with a "keep the ball" mantra which just ends up blunting everything we try to do and ends up having the reverse effect.

We are just so predictable. I don't want to see us giving the ball away unnecessarily but we need to take a few more risks with early deliveries to create a degree of uncertainty in the opposition. At the moment we are easy to play against.

Still, I suppose a reality check is reasonable. No idea how much Watford's squad cost but it's a hell of a lot more than ours. They just have better players. Maybe when we play teams more at our level we'll find things a bit easier. Maybe....


Can't disagree with this - no coincidence that one of the few times the Watford defence looked a bit lost was following an early, excellent whipped ball by Fornah that just evaded Joao. Sadly Ince miscontrolled at the key moment (which happened across the park last night) and the chance at a likely equaliser went with it.

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Re: MATCHWATCH : Watford (a)

by RG30 » 09 Nov 2022 12:47

Walked through the front door just before 1am thanks to the last fast train out of Paddington going at walking pace :( Very poor performance, created virtually nothing and never looked like scoring. Ejaria atrocious, his confidence appears shot to pieces. Saturday a very big game. Lose that and it's a difficult few weeks off.

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