Fans' Forum

[The Rouge]

I've moaned about stuff to do with the club in the past (along with other people on particular subjects - so it's not just my complaint) and no-one from STAR has ever pm'd me to ask more info or to offer to help. That is what is needed.

I agree with the rest of the post but I don't think it would be STAR's remit to seek extra info from individuals having a moan. The onus should be on individuals to contact STAR/the club - BUT STAR should be aware if there is a groundswell of opinion on something.

[Cypry]

However, I think it's the way you responded to Cypry that has got most people's backs up. It was his first fan's forum and he wasn't told that he couldn't post a summary on here, so your PM to him was pretty disgraceful IMO and he deserves an apology. I'm sure if you do this, we can all move on.

I have apologised and Cypry and I have had a conversation (where I got the pm right!) that has sorted things out.

^this - thanks for those who've been genuinely supportive regarding this, but I'd rather not be used as a stick to beat STAR any further, now that, as far as I'm concerned the matter has been put to bed....

[Ian Royal]

A few suggestions for STAR having been thoroughly pissed off and disillusioned by them having been a member for a while.

HNA? is one of four places it is easy to get access to Reading fans opinions. (Twitter, Facebook, Royals Redezvous) It probably has the largest number of regular contributers. And the largest collection of genuinely insightful and properly considered views from the fans. It is also full of utter crud and bickering. But hey, people suck.

STAR absolutely have to take HNA? seriously and convince the club to do the same. If you can't take issues from HNA? because the club and STAR feel there's an issue with anonymity and trolling / wumming. Don't sit there and take it. Do something about it.

It's not hard if you actively use HNA? as part as your work for STAR. And certainly not if you actually make your team pull their finger out and use it so you aren't the only one. If there's an issue you want some information on set up a thread with the question and ask people to post up their views, with some information that the club can use to confirm who they are. Post code and last 4 digits of their member number maybe. Link to a surveymonkey survey.

If people don't post up something that can be used to identify them, fair enough, you can claim anonymity. But to not even try to get views from here along with something to show it's from genuine fans and actually not all the same person, that's criminal for your organisation.

I appreciate that if STAR want to be successful the club has to consider them credible. It's something I'm very familiar with, it's my job. STAR do have to convince the club that they're on its side and want to help it do its job better so fans are happier as that helps it. Many fans are probably ill-informed. But that's the nature of the beast.

When you have a forum, your quick to publicise it. If you do that, you have to accept people who don't can't go want to know what happened. I accept you need to be careful what you make easily public. But you absolutely have to take control of the communication by being very clear that you will provide (an edited) summary, when you'll do it. And get it out there in a reasonable space of time. A week at absolute most. Then it should be on STAR's website, on HNA? on RR, and linked to on faceyb and twatter.

If you did this already. None of this shitstorm would have happened.

[blindedbythelights]

We have had Board members who are some of the most frequent HNA contributors in the past but at present the negativity on here has put off the current members.

thinking about this it must really suck. It would be a big black day for me and really blow if I were in position of these board members. Maybe some time away on the club tour will get the juices flowing and your pals will be back here ready to bring the resident dicks to their knees

[M U R T Y]

It's not the way it's ever appeared to be handled from an HNA posters point of view though.

All we ever read on here is that you can't take anything posted on here back to STAR or the club because of the anonymity. If anyone has an issue it's usually met with a 'send us an email' response and we'll look into it.

I'd always assume that you don't just filter out all the good suggestions that get made on the board, but there's very little in the way of recognition of what's been taken away as food for thought and discussion at STAR and what's been dismissed as HNA just having a moan.

Although I agree with the majority of comments regarding STAR and their relative value to Reading fans (STAR member or not) - I disagree on the above point. What is unreasonable about asking for an email/PM? I have personal experience of an issue raised a few years back with STAR (despite me not being a member - I have only been a member for one year many years ago) and STAR were good enough to look into it (following an email as requested), set up a meeting with the club with representatives from Stewarding and Customer Services, where the issue was discussed and largely resolved. At the said meeting, the value of HNA? was discussed and to a point, mocked by the club, but also pointed out the value of it in raising issues like the one being discussed.

I get the feeling that some posters (not aimed at you in particular Hoop Blah) expect STAR representatives running around HobNob noting down all gripes/moans/suggestions and taking them to the club and shouting off to the local media in the way you see supporter groups from larger clubs like LIverpool / Man Yoo act in the not too distant past.

FWIW, I think it was the Saints forum that has active readers employed by the football club that post on threads - they actively embrace it as a communication tool and probably nip alot of issues in the bud by providing a fuller explanation that an issue probably only needs to resolve confusion etc. If the club (or STAR as a liason route to the club) were to acknowledge this and perhaps by also responded to fan questions on Facebook/Twitter then I think the perception of communication between club and fans would increase tenfold.

In this Y generation, social media as a communication tool is not going to go away, so all people need to embrace, or get stuck in the past, where the perception that a quarterly newsletter is perceived as regular communication!!

[Albert Spangler]

We have had Board members who are some of the most frequent HNA contributors in the past but at present the negativity on here has put off the current members.

thinking about this it must really suck. It would be a big black day for me and really blow if I were in position of these board members. Maybe some time away on the club tour will get the juices flowing and your pals will be back here ready to bring the resident dicks to their knees

On one hand, you're a complete tosser, but...col

[Hoop Blah]

It's not the way it's ever appeared to be handled from an HNA posters point of view though.

All we ever read on here is that you can't take anything posted on here back to STAR or the club because of the anonymity. If anyone has an issue it's usually met with a 'send us an email' response and we'll look into it.

I'd always assume that you don't just filter out all the good suggestions that get made on the board, but there's very little in the way of recognition of what's been taken away as food for thought and discussion at STAR and what's been dismissed as HNA just having a moan.

Although I agree with the majority of comments regarding STAR and their relative value to Reading fans (STAR member or not) - I disagree on the above point. What is unreasonable about asking for an email/PM? I have personal experience of an issue raised a few years back with STAR (despite me not being a member - I have only been a member for one year many years ago) and STAR were good enough to look into it (following an email as requested), set up a meeting with the club with representatives from Stewarding and Customer Services, where the issue was discussed and largely resolved. At the said meeting, the value of HNA? was discussed and to a point, mocked by the club, but also pointed out the value of it in raising issues like the one being discussed.

If it's a specific individuals grievance or issue relating to them in a personal situation, as yours sounds, the yes of course it would need some kind of proper lines of communication. What the point above was about was general feelings and ideas coming from the discussions had on these pages.

As ever it seems to come back to the lines of communication and how open an organisation STAR want to be perceived to be (as I said this afternoon, perception is the key here) and how willing and successful they are to embrace the generally good source of debate and ideas HNA can be once you filter out some of the petty noise.

As IR says above, if the club don't give enough weight to opinion on here the there is the first thing that I think STAR need to be more successful in addressing. Unfortunately they seem far too happy to bury their heads in the same alongside some of those at the club.

Any decent organisation with such a strong customer community with ties into their 'product' embraces such tools. It seems neither the club nor STAR have woken up to that yet.

[Big Foot]

We have had Board members who are some of the most frequent HNA contributors in the past but at present the negativity on here has put off the current members.

thinking about this it must really suck. It would be a big black day for me and really blow if I were in position of these board members. Maybe some time away on the club tour will get the juices flowing and your pals will be back here ready to bring the resident dicks to their knees

Shit I lmao'd

[Green]

That’s what I expected when the STAR forum appeared, pretty much a ‘hive’ of STAR activity. It’s nothing of the sort.

Most under used board behind Board Announcements.

[Harpers So Solid Crew]

If I was running RFC and read through this and the other thread I would consider wondering if a group of people, so many of whom cannot talk in an adult manner without adding insults to the people that they are talking to(looking at you here IAnRoyal, you have let yourself down on this thread), are worth listening to at all.

Yes there is good debate on HNA? but there are people trying to run a football club under todays conditions, and like it or not that means in a business like manner.

It sadly means that catering is contracted out, and many other things as well, it means that security and stewarding is operated within guidelines from the local authority, it means ticket prices need to reflect the coat base of the club and its budget.

It does not seem so long ago that all folk wanted was TSI to throw money in and make RFC a bigger fish, yet look at all the doubters on that thread. It took time, it was delayed as sadly RFC had the temerity to gain promotion and the PL had to approve the new structure and owners.

[Green]

On a slightly seperate note, how is it that the club are able to contact Graham and get him to remove the offending message within hours of it being posted?

Have they got him on speed dial or something? And what else gets censored on here?

[STAR Liaison]

If it's a specific individuals grievance or issue relating to them in a personal situation, as yours sounds, the yes of course it would need some kind of proper lines of communication. What the point above was about was general feelings and ideas coming from the discussions had on these pages.

As ever it seems to come back to the lines of communication and how open an organisation STAR want to be perceived to be (as I said this afternoon, perception is the key here) and how willing and successful they are to embrace the generally good source of debate and ideas HNA can be once you filter out some of the petty noise.

As IR says above, if the club don't give enough weight to opinion on here the there is the first thing that I think STAR need to be more successful in addressing. Unfortunately they seem far too happy to bury their heads in the same alongside some of those at the club.

Any decent organisation with such a strong customer community with ties into their 'product' embraces such tools. It seems neither the club nor STAR have woken up to that yet.

I am glad that STAR was able to help MURTY and this is the way we are happy to help, members or not. The events we organise are designed to be more for members because of the cost involved; it does seem to be freeloading if you don't want to join STAR but benefit from what others are paying for.

Communication is the key - you are right but there are limits to what is feasible sometimes. I suspect from the amount of time some people spend on here that their jobs allow them constant access, but my job is not internet based so I make a special effort to read the board, that means it is hard to be sure to catch all that is on here let alone be completely sure of the validity of the poster of complaints. Several other board members have jobs that mean they cannot access it during the day so it is hard to give it the attention that the regulars on here can. An excuse I know, but realistic given that we are volunteers (and I know I will be accused of smugness) but there are also other demands on my free time. This week I have had to give HNA more attention than I can really afford. Hence your suggestion of a HNA regular helping is a good one. Is there a volunteer out there?

I have been trying for 10 years to get the club to take HNA seriously but as HSSC has said the threads lately have not helped at all, and the personal insults to Board members of STAR have also made it less likely that my successor will spend as much time as I have from what I have heard. Constructive criticism is one thing insults another.

[STAR Liaison]

On a slightly seperate note, how is it that the club are able to contact Graham and get him to remove the offending message within hours of it being posted?

Have they got him on speed dial or something? And what else gets censored on here?

From the copy I saw it was the old fashioned thing called an email.

As far as I am aware the only other censorship is when photos of RFC employees are posted.

[Green]

lol - one in particular springs to mind.

[Royal Biscuitman]

With regards to anonymity, I understand "someone on the internet called Royal Biscuitman said this that and other, we have no idea whether this is a real person or not but you should take it seriously and do something about it", However if that person is prepared to give STAR their name/details to confirm the report is genuine then STAR should (I'm sure they do) respect their wish to remain anonymous, perhaps for fear of retribution if contacting STAR for assistance/advice/representation about stewarding, policing or ticketing issues, Sure they may have to prove they are genuine to STAR but the club does not need to know their customer number, seat number, name, address, inside leg measurement etc etc etc if they do not wish this to be known.

STAR could be a crimestoppers for Reading fans who are intimidated to reveal themselves, but there has to be trust that STAR is independent of the club.

[Royal Lady]

I thought I had already volunteered to be more involved? I'll put myself forward as the link between HNA and STAR - but I won't hold my breath to get a reply.

As for Reading FC Official on FB - say anything negative and it is removed - and that's not anonymous - your name is there for all to see. Perhaps RFC have a little book with "troublemakers" names in?

From setting up a page on FB yesterday, I've got about 90 people interested in an alternative group so far - and that's without it being advertised to a wider audience. But, as I said on there, that was to gauge opinion - I don't relish the task of setting up an alternative group - when there is a perfectly good group already established, which just needs tweaking, imo, to cater for ALL fans.

The crux of the matter is, a lot of people do not feel that STAR act for the supporter - they do not appear to go against the club at all - they seem to roll over as soon as the club say something and the "that's the way it is" mantra is trotted out. I hope someone from the club has seen this thread and someone with a bit of commonsense realises that the best way for everyone to work together for the good of the club and its supporters is to listen and communicate - whether they like what is being said to them or not.

The hooped shirt is a prime example. WE'RE the supporters. WE pay the money to keep this club going. If the club are told that a large number of fans want a return to hoops - WHY don't they consult a representative from the Supporter's Association with their ideas when coming up with designs for a new shirt? Sure, you're not going to please everyone - but at least if fans knew their input had been taken on board, it would sit much better with them than "we'll have the shirt WE want, we don't listen to anonymous comments on a fans' messageboard" or whatever.


In future, I would suggest that STAR make better use of their forum on this board - encourage people to put their grievances or whatever on the STAR board - someone collate them and the comments - weed out the WUMs and pass them to the STAR board who then put them to the club and insist that the queries or whatever are given due consideration. Then report the response fro the club. Again, some people will accept what the club says, others won't - it's the nature of the beast, but at least people will see that something has been done whether it is resolved or not - which is far better than what appears to happen at the moment. Communication is the key - as has been said time and again on here.

[Green]

Have to agree with Royal Lady here - hard to see anyone arguing against improved communication, and hard to argue that this forum is not a good place (forum, if you will) for that communication to happen.

Unless you don't like giving people the right of reply, of course.

[wingnut]

I've moaned

Christ, don't we know it


Etc etc

[Wimb]

I thought I had already volunteered to be more involved? I'll put myself forward as the link between HNA and STAR - but I won't hold my breath to get a reply.

As for Reading FC Official on FB - say anything negative and it is removed - and that's not anonymous - your name is there for all to see. Perhaps RFC have a little book with "troublemakers" names in?

From setting up a page on FB yesterday, I've got about 90 people interested in an alternative group so far - and that's without it being advertised to a wider audience. But, as I said on there, that was to gauge opinion - I don't relish the task of setting up an alternative group - when there is a perfectly good group already established, which just needs tweaking, imo, to cater for ALL fans.

The crux of the matter is, a lot of people do not feel that STAR act for the supporter - they do not appear to go against the club at all - they seem to roll over as soon as the club say something and the "that's the way it is" mantra is trotted out. I hope someone from the club has seen this thread and someone with a bit of commonsense realises that the best way for everyone to work together for the good of the club and its supporters is to listen and communicate - whether they like what is being said to them or not.

The hooped shirt is a prime example. WE'RE the supporters. WE pay the money to keep this club going. If the club are told that a large number of fans want a return to hoops - WHY don't they consult a representative from the Supporter's Association with their ideas when coming up with designs for a new shirt? Sure, you're not going to please everyone - but at least if fans knew their input had been taken on board, it would sit much better with them than "we'll have the shirt WE want, we don't listen to anonymous comments on a fans' messageboard" or whatever.


In future, I would suggest that STAR make better use of their forum on this board - encourage people to put their grievances or whatever on the STAR board - someone collate them and the comments - weed out the WUMs and pass them to the STAR board who then put them to the club and insist that the queries or whatever are given due consideration. Then report the response fro the club. Again, some people will accept what the club says, others won't - it's the nature of the beast, but at least people will see that something has been done whether it is resolved or not - which is far better than what appears to happen at the moment. Communication is the key - as has been said time and again on here.

In return for this service, would you be happy to pay a fee to join STAR? Or do you not believe a fee should be charged?

[Royal Lady]

Well, as I'd be the go-between for STAR and HNA - I don't know that it would justify the STAR membership fee - but I'm not going to baulk at it, if that's what it will take.