RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

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The Rouge
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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by The Rouge » 13 Aug 2012 21:49

starliaison
Dirk Gently 3. I believed that STAR was slowly dying as an organisation through lack of new-blood coming through. STAR had never had an election and didn't have a membership which was properly representative of all Reading supporters. That's not down to STAR, as it represented its members, but that was a by-product of the fact that STAR's members primarily join to travel by coach (*). I felt STAR had never found a way to answer the question “I don’t travel by coach, why should I pay a tenner to join STAR?” - and that was damaging them as an organisation and shaping their policies in the wrong direction. I believe STAR needs to open its membership wider and cheaper (possibly via a zero-cost, e-membership, or maybe a very low-cost membership with "top-up" for "Travel membership") so that it will be more attractive to *all* Reading supporters. With a larger membership, it'll be more effective, more representative and it'll have a much larger talent-pool of people who will, hopefully, participate more.

Don't get me wrong, I put a lot of effort into helping found STAR and helping run it for 8 years, and I don't want to damage it or get into a slanging match with anyone. But I want STAR to be a dynamic, representative and inclusive mass-membership campaigning organisation, as I believe that Reading supporters need and deserve an organisation like that. I could see STAR getting less and less effective and moving further and further away from being the type of organisation I believe it needs to be, and got to the point where what I felt I could achieve through STAR wasn't worth the time I was putting into it.


I know all too well how much you put into STAR Dirk, and I don't want a slanging match either as we have both put in many more hours for our fellow supporters than most if not all of STAR's critics. We may disagree on parts of STAR's purpose but we have tried to involve others and it has slowly happened.

FYI since you resigned we have had new volunteers standing for election so the new blood is coming in, and they are not regular (if at all) coach travellers and also not friends of existing board members, so it is still progressing and this year was very close to having to hold an election, which as you know is the goal (not often attained) of most supporters trusts.


Unless RL has got it wrong, I can't take anything you say seriously about wanting to be representative of Reading Fans when your policy is to ignore the largest online or offline community Hob Nob Anyone?

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Royal With Cheese » 13 Aug 2012 23:03

Possibly because they don't want a large proportion of the audience shouting "+1" or drawing cocks and spunk on Jason Roberts.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Royal Lady » 14 Aug 2012 09:17

Starliaison said the others didn't agree because they didn't like the personal abuse on here after the Fan's Forum debacle (debacle my word, not hers) - one person's boss saw it at work or something and it caused a problem. :|

I have to say, ignoring the fact they've said no to my offer, only asking a few STAR members via their e-STAR (what is that?) method to have the chance to attend this Radio 5 Live thing does rather smack (to me at least) of a little insular group, unwilling to spread out into the wider RFC supporting community. The fact it wasn't even mentioned on the STAR portion of this board is proof that they hold all of us in contempt I'm afraid.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Harpers So Solid Crew » 14 Aug 2012 09:37

I would assume that E-STAR is their email information set up. so they sent the details to members and places were filled quickly. TBH if I was looking to find an audience from RFC fans STAR is exactly were I would go.

Why would youi ask anonymous people along, froma forum that is mostly members only, and I know STAR appears the same in many peoples eyes.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Royal Lady » 14 Aug 2012 09:46

Tbf maybe it was advertised on the RFC official page, I don't know. But STAR were asked by the club to find fans who were interested in going - presumably so they could have the headache of receiving loads of emails or whatever rather than the club having to do anything. I don't agree, however, that should mean that only members of STAR are told about it, if that were the case.


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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Alexander Litvinenko » 14 Aug 2012 09:52

Can't honestly see why they should have put it onto HNA? when they have more then enough of their own members to fill it. That's not being insular - that's just being practical.

And even more as they know that a fair percentage of HNA? are WUMs who support other clubs. Why open themselves to the risk of any of them coming along "for the LoLs"?

STAR can be criticised for some things, but I don't think this is one of them. If you're upset at not hearing things from STAR, pay the membership fee and then they'll be obliged to communicate with you.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Barry the bird boggler » 14 Aug 2012 09:55

Dirk Gently
3. I believed that STAR was slowly dying as an organisation through lack of new-blood coming through. STAR had never had an election and didn't have a membership which was properly representative of all Reading supporters. That's not down to STAR, as it represented its members, but that was a by-product of the fact that STAR's members primarily join to travel by coach (*). I felt STAR had never found a way to answer the question “I don’t travel by coach, why should I pay a tenner to join STAR?” - and that was damaging them as an organisation and shaping their policies in the wrong direction. I believe STAR needs to open its membership wider and cheaper (possibly via a zero-cost, e-membership, or maybe a very low-cost membership with "top-up" for "Travel membership") so that it will be more attractive to *all* Reading supporters. With a larger membership, it'll be more effective, more representative and it'll have a much larger talent-pool of people who will, hopefully, participate more.


That is an excellent idea and just what the organisation needs to bring fresh blood into the organisation. I'd even be happy to help administer such a scheme if it got the thumbs up.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Royal Lady » 14 Aug 2012 09:59

Was it mentioned on the RFC official page do you know? Maybe using HNA would not have been practical, but I do feel that just because the club asked STAR to organise something which a lot of supporters might have been interested in, that shouldn't necessarily mean that STAR members only are aware of it. It's not a STAR-organised event as such, is it. That was my point. RFC fans need a mouthpiece for them and if getting that mouthpiece means you have to pay £10 to become a member of STAR, I, personally, don't think that is right. Starliaison has more or less admitted that, up to now, the board members are a cliquey bunch of mates - and they appear to be resistant to change and progress. Maybe time will prove me wrong, but in the meantime, RFC supporters who don't/can't/refuse or whatever to join STAR are sidelined and the fans on here, most of whom are not WUMs or trolls, are treated as some sort of pariah - whose input is not worthy of any consideration whatsoever unless they join STAR.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Alexander Litvinenko » 14 Aug 2012 10:05

Agreed, the club's supporters should have a mouthpiece. But why should you get that for nothing? Life's not like that.

If you want to be represented, and if you want the chance to influence the club and the organisation that has the most collective influence with the club, as well as a say in deciding who your representatives are, then I don't think £10 a year is too much to pay for that.


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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Cobi » 14 Aug 2012 10:05

Alexander Litvinenko Can't honestly see why they should have put it onto HNA? when they have more then enough of their own members to fill it. That's not being insular - that's just being practical.

And even more as they know that a fair percentage of HNA? are WUMs who support other clubs. Why open themselves to the risk of any of them coming along "for the LoLs"?

STAR can be criticised for some things, but I don't think this is one of them. If you're upset at not hearing things from STAR, pay the membership fee and then they'll be obliged to communicate with you.


Dirk, you're confusing me. Why are you using two usernames? :|

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by The Rouge » 14 Aug 2012 10:34

Alexander Litvinenko Agreed, the club's supporters should have a mouthpiece. But why should you get that for nothing? Life's not like that.

If you want to be represented, and if you want the chance to influence the club and the organisation that has the most collective influence with the club, as well as a say in deciding who your representatives are, then I don't think £10 a year is too much to pay for that.


- I agree its a non-story re: filling the slots for this programme.

- Re: 'Agreed, the club's supporters should have a mouthpiece. But why should you get that for nothing? Life's not like that', my thoughts are:

a. £10 is not much. I would happily pay that if I thought I got anything of value out of it but I don't think they would adequately represent my views/the general views of Reading fans, I don't live in/near Reading so would never use coach travel, nor be easily able to attend a fans forum. Therefore I don't join. I would have thought a Reading FC obsessed fan of 18 years would be a good target member.

b. Regardless of the membership issue, it is the fact that they are seemingly not actually that interested in representing the views of Reading fans that I can't stomach. For whatever they say their actions suggest this. Reading between the lines they enjoy their cosy relationship with the club and would rather maintain that than adequately represent views.

Note: I am not a serial complainer and I don't think there is a whole lot to moan about as a Reading fan as they have been and hopefully are pretty well-run club at the top. (Ticketing and Marcomms has been pretty amateur though IMO)

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by peterroyal76 » 14 Aug 2012 11:00

Compo's Hat Hope STAR realise everyone will be able to hear this on the BBC!


I just saw a bloke dressed in a bobble hat and scarf in a full Reading kit with Anton's name on the back go into Maplin's and buy up their entire stock of radio frequency jammers.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Green » 14 Aug 2012 12:36

peterroyal76
Compo's Hat Hope STAR realise everyone will be able to hear this on the BBC!


I just saw a bloke dressed in a bobble hat and scarf in a full Reading kit with Anton's name on the back go into Maplin's and buy up their entire stock of radio frequency jammers.

:lol:


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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Alexander Litvinenko » 14 Aug 2012 12:38

The Rouge
Alexander Litvinenko Agreed, the club's supporters should have a mouthpiece. But why should you get that for nothing? Life's not like that.

If you want to be represented, and if you want the chance to influence the club and the organisation that has the most collective influence with the club, as well as a say in deciding who your representatives are, then I don't think £10 a year is too much to pay for that.


- I agree its a non-story re: filling the slots for this programme.

- Re: 'Agreed, the club's supporters should have a mouthpiece. But why should you get that for nothing? Life's not like that', my thoughts are:

a. £10 is not much. I would happily pay that if I thought I got anything of value out of it but I don't think they would adequately represent my views/the general views of Reading fans, I don't live in/near Reading so would never use coach travel, nor be easily able to attend a fans forum. Therefore I don't join. I would have thought a Reading FC obsessed fan of 18 years would be a good target member.

b. Regardless of the membership issue, it is the fact that they are seemingly not actually that interested in representing the views of Reading fans that I can't stomach. For whatever they say their actions suggest this. Reading between the lines they enjoy their cosy relationship with the club and would rather maintain that than adequately represent views.

Note: I am not a serial complainer and I don't think there is a whole lot to moan about as a Reading fan as they have been and hopefully are pretty well-run club at the top. (Ticketing and Marcomms has been pretty amateur though IMO)


But it's a chicken and egg situation. Don't join because they don't represent you and they never will. Join, have your say and they have to take notice if enough people say the same.

They are a properly-constituted democracy, answerable to their members, and they do represent their members - the membership base at the moment doesn't share your wants and needs, though, and a large percentage joined for other reasons than to be represented.

£10 buys you the right to be represented, and the right to have your say on what they do, how they operate and who the STAR Board member are. If people don't join them because they don't feel represented then they will continue to only represent their current, smaller, membership - and that will be less likely to coincide with what you want from them.

But, tbh, can you really blame any membership organisation for concentrating its efforts and communications on the people who are motivated enough by them to pay the massive sum of £10 a year?

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by The Rouge » 14 Aug 2012 12:56

Some good points, and the Travel Club thing is a big issue, but it all just seems a bit defeatist.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Royal Lady » 14 Aug 2012 13:03

If someone could guarantee that a group of us joining STAR and then making our views known to the "Powers that be" amongst STAR would not just be dismissed as "trouble making" - I'd consider joining - but I don't think anyone could guarantee that our views would be listened to, let alone possibly acted upon.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Alexander Litvinenko » 14 Aug 2012 13:10

^^
Now that's defeatist......

One voice may not be enough to force change, but enough voices would. They are a democracy - legally, they have to be. Stand for the Board - make a difference!

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by Green » 14 Aug 2012 13:28

£10 does seem like quite a lot if you don't use the coaches or attend the fans forums.

And it needs to be the other way round - I joined CAMRA for example because they represent my views, I didn't join them hoping to turn them into a barley water and orange squash campaign.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by melonhead » 14 Aug 2012 13:51

Royal Lady If someone could guarantee that a group of us joining STAR and then making our views known to the "Powers that be" amongst STAR would not just be dismissed as "trouble making" - I'd consider joining - but I don't think anyone could guarantee that our views would be listened to, let alone possibly acted upon.


tbf you arent going to get a guarantee that theyll pay much attention to you. they dont know you.
if you join you could affect change from within the organisation, and work with them to build an organisation you think the fans want.
not joining, but moaning that you think theyll only ignore you is a bit defeatist.

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Re: RFC supporters on Radio 5 Live this Thursday evening

by STAR Liaison » 14 Aug 2012 14:24

Royal Lady Tbf maybe it was advertised on the RFC official page, I don't know. But STAR were asked by the club to find fans who were interested in going - presumably so they could have the headache of receiving loads of emails or whatever rather than the club having to do anything. I don't agree, however, that should mean that only members of STAR are told about it, if that were the case.



See my first posting - it was the BBC who contacted me not the club, and we were asked to get an audience of our members. If you don't agree then blame the BBC not RFC of STAR

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