Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

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bcubed
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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by bcubed » 29 Nov 2022 08:57

Conservative_dad
bcubed
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So what's your actual rule?


I assume it's the old way.
Must be deliberate handball otherwise no free kick.

If so I agree it should be this way. I feel there used to be far less disagreement about what was a penalty. And I reckon less of them.

Failing that if they really want to change it just make it the same as hockey. If it hits your hand in the penalty area it's a pen. No argument.

Currently we seem to have an unsatisfactory half way house.


So what is deliberate? Bruno had megged the defender and was past him into the penalty area

- If that gets given against England and we go out I'd be livid
- If that doesn't get given for England and we go out I'd be livid


Don't think that one was deliberate. He wasn't looking at the ball. And isn't that what Peter Walton is saying too?

But yeh I think we can agree we'll be livid whatever happens

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by 6ft Kerplunk » 29 Nov 2022 09:07

Mr Angry It has been good to see that there has been a trend for African, Asian and Middle Eastern teams to exceed expectations in this World Cup, however, is that down to us European fans having an arrogance that we believe that these nations are much weaker then they really are?

Exhibit #1 Wales 0, Iran 2
Exhibit #2 Belgium 0, Morocco 2
Exhibit #3 Germany 1, Japan 2
Exhibit #4, Argentina 1, Saudi Arabia 2


I'm suggesting this without bothering to look up any other league schedules from around the world but having it slap bang in the middle of the European seasons giving most squads only a few days of training is probably having some effect. Mitigated a bit I guess by the top players from all continents generally playing their football in Europe.

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by Hendo » 29 Nov 2022 09:30

6ft Kerplunk
Mr Angry It has been good to see that there has been a trend for African, Asian and Middle Eastern teams to exceed expectations in this World Cup, however, is that down to us European fans having an arrogance that we believe that these nations are much weaker then they really are?

Exhibit #1 Wales 0, Iran 2
Exhibit #2 Belgium 0, Morocco 2
Exhibit #3 Germany 1, Japan 2
Exhibit #4, Argentina 1, Saudi Arabia 2


I'm suggesting this without bothering to look up any other league schedules from around the world but having it slap bang in the middle of the European seasons giving most squads only a few days of training is probably having some effect. Mitigated a bit I guess by the top players from all continents generally playing their football in Europe.


Quite possibly that, although...

I'd also suggest that Exhibit 1 isn't that much of a shock. Wales are ranked 19th and Iran 20th, if you took a normal league game, you wouldn't really be that surprised if the team 1 place below you beat you 2-0.

Morocco are ranked in the top 25 and Belgium have been on a downward trajectory for a while - they looked poor against Canada and their whole team is on the old side - still a small shock though, but not one that is earth shattering.

Japan are also ranked in the top 25 and Germany aren't the force they once used to be, however still a small shock, but not earth shattering.

Exhibit 4, I would say was a genuine shock, I didn't watch the game so can't comment on how KSA played, but you're always going to get a shock or two like that in a tournament. Argentina probably underestimated them a fair amount.

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by Dirk Gently » 29 Nov 2022 09:35

6ft Kerplunk
Mr Angry It has been good to see that there has been a trend for African, Asian and Middle Eastern teams to exceed expectations in this World Cup, however, is that down to us European fans having an arrogance that we believe that these nations are much weaker then they really are?

Exhibit #1 Wales 0, Iran 2
Exhibit #2 Belgium 0, Morocco 2
Exhibit #3 Germany 1, Japan 2
Exhibit #4, Argentina 1, Saudi Arabia 2


I'm suggesting this without bothering to look up any other league schedules from around the world but having it slap bang in the middle of the European seasons giving most squads only a few days of training is probably having some effect. Mitigated a bit I guess by the top players from all continents generally playing their football in Europe.


I was pondering on this. Certainly "European" standards of coaching are more available worldwide than they were a few years ago, but I do wonder if it's about expectations and motivation :

- "European teams" expect to win (they subconsciously believe the old stereotypes so maybe put 1% or so less into the match without realising it
- Non-established players recognise that a good world cup could get them a move to a big European club that could literally change their lives and the lives of their families, so it's all or nothing for them; for established players it's just another game
- Then there's nationalism - in developing countries there are political or nationalistic motivations that make playing for your country so much more than it does to European countries

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by YorkshireRoyal99 » 29 Nov 2022 09:39

I think it's just a case of those sides mentioned, Iran, Japan, Saudi Arabia and Morocco aren't that bad. As mentioned, if you're in the top sort of 25 in the world, you clearly aren't a bad side and I think there is an element of European arrogance because they are playing against a lot of dross, such as China in Asia or Tanzania in Africa. But there is still a lot of dross in Europe as well, but probably to a lesser extent by proportion.

Not all the teams that didn't qualify from Africa are dross though. For example, think of the likes of Ivory Coast and Algeria who would likely be fairly competitive sides and maybe not much worser (if at all) to sides in Europe that didn't qualify like Sweden.

These sides might be beating "a lot of dross", but there's obviously a reason why they are where they are. The world rankings shouldn't be taken as gospel obviously, but I'd say they give a fairly decent indicator of the strength of most sides.

There are probably a lot more psychological and political factors as well for some players playing in Africa and Asia, which is why I like the World Cup as it gives it that unique feel and there is something special about Morocco packing the terraces and generating an atmosphere similar to a home game as well as Ghana celebrating goals as if they've won the World Cup etc.


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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by 6ft Kerplunk » 29 Nov 2022 10:26

Not having 4 games a day sucks balls.

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by Hendo » 29 Nov 2022 10:38

6ft Kerplunk Not having 4 games a day sucks balls.


Technically there are still 4 games today :wink:

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by Silver Fox » 29 Nov 2022 10:57

6ft Kerplunk Not having 4 games a day sucks balls.


Starting 5 hours later is the real killer

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by 6ft Kerplunk » 29 Nov 2022 11:37

Hendo
6ft Kerplunk Not having 4 games a day sucks balls.


Technically there are still 4 games today :wink:

Good point. Not having 4 different start times a day sucks balls.
Is anyone doing an NFL Redzone style coverage?


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genome
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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by genome » 29 Nov 2022 11:43

Kinda a shame that I won't really watch USA vs Iran as there's going to be a lot of needle in that one

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by Hendo » 29 Nov 2022 11:47

6ft Kerplunk
Hendo
6ft Kerplunk Not having 4 games a day sucks balls.


Technically there are still 4 games today :wink:

Good point. Not having 4 different start times a day sucks balls.
Is anyone doing an NFL Redzone style coverage?


:mrgreen:

I doubt it, but usually the two games that are on at the same time are broadcast by the same channel, so would imagine that if you watch the game in ITV1/BBC1, they'll show highlights, etc, from the other game.

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by genome » 29 Nov 2022 12:06



Group G and H are exactly the same

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by 6ft Kerplunk » 29 Nov 2022 12:12

Hendo
6ft Kerplunk
Hendo
Technically there are still 4 games today :wink:

Good point. Not having 4 different start times a day sucks balls.
Is anyone doing an NFL Redzone style coverage?


:mrgreen:

I doubt it, but usually the two games that are on at the same time are broadcast by the same channel, so would imagine that if you watch the game in ITV1/BBC1, they'll show highlights, etc, from the other game.


Should probably add "and matches not overlapping" to the 4 different start times before some twat pipes up.
Guess there's not really a need for redzone coverage when there's only two games. They normally show goals from the other match if it affects the outcome of the group don't they?


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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by Silver Fox » 29 Nov 2022 13:00

It's what your iPad's for I guess.

I'm sure someone will insist on the licence fee being cancelled if the Beeb have the temerity to show a Christian Pulisic goal while they should be concentrating on the battle of Britain (not taking into account that ITV will probably still be on an ad break when Jordan Henderson smashes in the winner in the opening seconds of extra time in the final)

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by Loafer » 29 Nov 2022 13:01

genome Kinda a shame that I won't really watch USA vs Iran as there's going to be a lot of needle in that one

You have a choice. I'm watching usa vs iran

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by genome » 29 Nov 2022 13:15

What did he say?

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by Winston Biscuit » 29 Nov 2022 13:31

he called you a pcunt and said he was going to beat you up

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by fartdad » 29 Nov 2022 13:38

We are in control of our destiny, if we win we are through.. if we lose or tie we out. I don’t think we beat Iran because our coach has brain worms.

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by bcubed » 29 Nov 2022 14:04

Sounds like Foden Rashford Henderson and Kyle Walker will all play

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Re: Qatar Hero - The World Cup 2022 thread

by Greatwesternline » 29 Nov 2022 14:07

YorkshireRoyal99 I think it's just a case of those sides mentioned, Iran, Japan, Saudi Arabia and Morocco aren't that bad. As mentioned, if you're in the top sort of 25 in the world, you clearly aren't a bad side and I think there is an element of European arrogance because they are playing against a lot of dross, such as China in Asia or Tanzania in Africa. But there is still a lot of dross in Europe as well, but probably to a lesser extent by proportion.

Not all the teams that didn't qualify from Africa are dross though. For example, think of the likes of Ivory Coast and Algeria who would likely be fairly competitive sides and maybe not much worser (if at all) to sides in Europe that didn't qualify like Sweden.

These sides might be beating "a lot of dross", but there's obviously a reason why they are where they are. The world rankings shouldn't be taken as gospel obviously, but I'd say they give a fairly decent indicator of the strength of most sides.

There are probably a lot more psychological and political factors as well for some players playing in Africa and Asia, which is why I like the World Cup as it gives it that unique feel and there is something special about Morocco packing the terraces and generating an atmosphere similar to a home game as well as Ghana celebrating goals as if they've won the World Cup etc.


Many of Japan's players play in the Bundesliga. Itso facto they are extremely accomplished footballers. The medium ranked teams are probably getting better at the organisational side of the game.

I think relatively, the less good teams are getting better quicker than the best teams. Football is a game of tight margins, Germany created 4 massive chances and should have been about 3 or 4 goals up when Japan scored.

Teams which can put out more than half players from top european leagues can be seen to be about as good as a mid table PL or Bundesliga team. Sometimes Bundesliga teams cause an upset against Bayern.

In the future, you would imagine countries with big populations will begin to be as good as the traditional countries. Japan as a developed country with massive population is perhaps only 30 years away from being very good at football. Football has taken on a bigger part of life throughout the world compared to the world of football up until perhaps 15-20 years ago.

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