VAR

[stealthpapes]

That's one of my big issues with VAR tbf, how far back is it worth looking at? It's mental that a corner can be given erroneously that a team could score from but VAR wouldn't be used to fix that clear and obvious error because the corner decision was such a long time before the goal.

Offside calls should relate purely to the player who scored the goal. Sick of this nonsense with someone being offside in the build up to the goal totally unrelated to the player who scored.

Disagree slightly.

In that incident, Blue midfielder plays the ball to the left winger (who is in a marginal offside position there), right? He plays the ball back (which is when the replay in the video linked starts (2:11)). If that third pass to the blue forward running into the left channel was to a player in an offside position, as he then makes the decisive cross. I would say that would be worth flagging as offside and/or checking - anything before that gets less certain.

[Franchise FC]

That's one of my big issues with VAR tbf, how far back is it worth looking at? It's mental that a corner can be given erroneously that a team could score from but VAR wouldn't be used to fix that clear and obvious error because the corner decision was such a long time before the goal.

Offside calls should relate purely to the player who scored the goal. Sick of this nonsense with someone being offside in the build up to the goal totally unrelated to the player who scored.

Disagree slightly.

In that incident, Blue midfielder plays the ball to the left winger (who is in a marginal offside position there), right? He plays the ball back (which is when the replay in the video linked starts (2:11)). If that third pass to the blue forward running into the left channel was to a player in an offside position, as he then makes the decisive cross. I would say that would be worth flagging as offside and/or checking - anything before that gets less certain.

But this 'earlier in the move' nonsense isn't even applied consistently.

And back we go to Trent Alexander-Arnold and the ball hitting his arm in the game vs City.
Not because I think it was a penalty, but because use of an arm in ANY circumstances leading to a goal is then deemed handball.

We need a time cut-off beyond which VAR doesn't go back. And yes, I know that wouldn't work for certain other types of incident.

Just a shambles

[Sanguine]

On the TAA incident, I would guess a distinction could be made there in the fact that he was defending at the time at which the ball hit his arm. He then started the attack. But I agree that the time period needs looking at, as per Shrewsbury's harshly (imho) disallowed goal.

[Franchise FC]

On the TAA incident, I would guess a distinction could be made there in the fact that he was defending at the time at which the ball hit his arm. He then started the attack. But I agree that the time period needs looking at, as per Shrewsbury's harshly (imho) disallowed goal.

The problem with the TAA incident is that it probably isn’t a penalty. However, if it’s deemed part of the goal, it must be disallowed and then the ONLY choice is to give handball and thus a penalty - for something that probably wasn’t.
As I said - shambles

[Tails]

Said it before but I’ll say it again, VAR is only highlighting the inadequacies of the rules in Football. When you couple that with this inherent desire to make mountains out of mole hills found within football, we get what we have here.

[Stranded]

On the TAA incident, I would guess a distinction could be made there in the fact that he was defending at the time at which the ball hit his arm. He then started the attack. But I agree that the time period needs looking at, as per Shrewsbury's harshly (imho) disallowed goal.

The problem with the TAA incident is that it probably isn’t a penalty. However, if it’s deemed part of the goal, it must be disallowed and then the ONLY choice is to give handball and thus a penalty - for something that probably wasn’t.
As I said - shambles

That is the massive problem with having put a distinction in the rules between an attacking handball and a defensive one - a ball can hit a defenders hand and not be considered a foul but hit a strikers and it automatically rules out a goal even if the handball had no direct impact on the goal itself i.e. it was a light brush of the arm 30 yards from goal of a player who neither scored nor set up the finish.

[tmesis]

Said it before but I’ll say it again, VAR is only highlighting the inadequacies of the rules in Football. When you couple that with this inherent desire to make mountains out of mole hills found within football, we get what we have here.

Yeah. The problem behind a lot of them is that most can understand the point of the rule, but defining it so it isn't subjective often renders it stupid.

The handball rule, for example, is all about stopping people using their hands/arms to control the ball, but trying to define what "controlling" means isn't easy. We moaned about inconsistency in interpretation from referees, then moan again when it is consistent, because we don't like the impact.

[Franchise FC]

Said it before but I’ll say it again, VAR is only highlighting the inadequacies of the rules in Football. When you couple that with this inherent desire to make mountains out of mole hills found within football, we get what we have here.

Yeah. The problem behind a lot of them is that most can understand the point of the rule, but defining it so it isn't subjective often renders it stupid.

The handball rule, for example, is all about stopping people using their hands/arms to control the ball, but trying to define what "controlling" means isn't easy. We moaned about inconsistency in interpretation from referees, then moan again when it is consistent, because we don't like the impact.

Except that it isn’t consistent. Attackers and defenders are treated completely differently. Under no circumstances is that consistent.

[tmesis]

Said it before but I’ll say it again, VAR is only highlighting the inadequacies of the rules in Football. When you couple that with this inherent desire to make mountains out of mole hills found within football, we get what we have here.

Yeah. The problem behind a lot of them is that most can understand the point of the rule, but defining it so it isn't subjective often renders it stupid.

The handball rule, for example, is all about stopping people using their hands/arms to control the ball, but trying to define what "controlling" means isn't easy. We moaned about inconsistency in interpretation from referees, then moan again when it is consistent, because we don't like the impact.

Except that it isn’t consistent. Attackers and defenders are treated completely differently. Under no circumstances is that consistent.

It's consistent in that we have this stupid rule that if a shot hits an arm and goes in, it must be disallowed. There's consistency in that these days, if there's "contact" that's deemed a penalty. It's consistent that even if you are 1 mm offside, then you are offside.

It's the inability to define what really ought to be a foul that's the problem, as the definition is now too strict.

The handball law is to stop people controlling the ball with their hand. The offside law is there to stop people gaining an unfair advantage by goalhanging, or just standing behind the last defender. The foul tackle rule was to stop players tripping an opponent to stop them. Quite often intent was the issue, but that got removed, and the result is players who opt to play for the foul.

[URZZZZ]

Thought it came to the correct decision today to award the penalty for Spurs. Got the man first, then the ball. Although it did take quite a while to come to the outcome, not sure why Dean Smith is complaining that it wasn’t a foul

[Franchise FC]

Thought it came to the correct decision today to award the penalty for Spurs. Got the man first, then the ball. Although it did take quite a while to come to the outcome, not sure why Dean Smith is complaining that it wasn’t a foul

He’s complaining because they lost and needs something, or someone, to blame.
How often do your hear a manager say “That was definitely a penalty we gave away” and normally when it’s the most stonewall

[John Smith]

Thought it came to the correct decision today to award the penalty for Spurs. Got the man first, then the ball. Although it did take quite a while to come to the outcome, not sure why Dean Smith is complaining that it wasn’t a foul

He’s complaining because they lost and needs something, or someone, to blame.
How often do your hear a manager say “That was definitely a penalty we gave away” and normally when it’s the most stonewall

Not a pen for me. No appeal whatsoever. It should have been a corner.

[South Coast Royal]

Atkinson once again showing what a poor ref he is (are Oliver and at a push Dean the only ones who are any good?).
I'm not criticising him for not giving the penalty in the Spurs game, it's the persistent fouling that he and others don't do anything about.
The likes of Xaka and Fernandhino do it every game at least 3 or 4 times before being booked and yet in most of the matches that we see at the Mad Stad the refs jump in and flash the yellow card after one or two tackles.

I have heard the expression "managing the game" which means that the ref isn't booking anybody and TV commentators love saying "it's good to see the ref keeping his cards in his pocket" and yet in some game elsewhere a ref will be booking a player just because the other player has stayed on the ground after a 50/50 challenge or for kicking the ball away.

Atkinson also never seems to add on enough time and a ref the other day, I think it was Kavanagh, only added on a minute when there had been 2 goals and two stoppages.
I do wish there were stadium clocks as in Rugby League that are stopped when there is an injury hold-up or a VAR check.
Time-keeping should not be at the whim of a referee and/or his 4th official.

[Hendo]

Atkinson once again showing what a poor ref he is (are Oliver and at a push Dean the only ones who are any good?).
I'm not criticising him for not giving the penalty in the Spurs game, it's the persistent fouling that he and others don't do anything about.
The likes of Xaka and Fernandhino do it every game at least 3 or 4 times before being booked and yet in most of the matches that we see at the Mad Stad the refs jump in and flash the yellow card after one or two tackles.

I have heard the expression "managing the game" which means that the ref isn't booking anybody and TV commentators love saying "it's good to see the ref keeping his cards in his pocket" and yet in some game elsewhere a ref will be booking a player just because the other player has stayed on the ground after a 50/50 challenge or for kicking the ball away.

Atkinson also never seems to add on enough time and a ref the other day, I think it was Kavanagh, only added on a minute when there had been 2 goals and two stoppages.
I do wish there were stadium clocks as in Rugby League that are stopped when there is an injury hold-up or a VAR check.
Time-keeping should not be at the whim of a referee and/or his 4th official.

Xhaka got booked after 9 minutes yesterday

[South Coast Royal]

Atkinson once again showing what a poor ref he is (are Oliver and at a push Dean the only ones who are any good?).
I'm not criticising him for not giving the penalty in the Spurs game, it's the persistent fouling that he and others don't do anything about.
The likes of Xaka and Fernandhino do it every game at least 3 or 4 times before being booked and yet in most of the matches that we see at the Mad Stad the refs jump in and flash the yellow card after one or two tackles.

I have heard the expression "managing the game" which means that the ref isn't booking anybody and TV commentators love saying "it's good to see the ref keeping his cards in his pocket" and yet in some game elsewhere a ref will be booking a player just because the other player has stayed on the ground after a 50/50 challenge or for kicking the ball away.

Atkinson also never seems to add on enough time and a ref the other day, I think it was Kavanagh, only added on a minute when there had been 2 goals and two stoppages.
I do wish there were stadium clocks as in Rugby League that are stopped when there is an injury hold-up or a VAR check.
Time-keeping should not be at the whim of a referee and/or his 4th official.

Xhaka got booked after 9 minutes yesterday

Yes he did-this time a bit more blatant than normal rather than just a block.
Atkinson would have probably let it go.

[Franchise FC]

What the hell is going on with VAR ?

Maguire clearly kicked out at Bat Shit Crazy. No punishment when it absolutely should have been red. At least as bad as Son’s

The 2” closer to goal and Chelsea would have had a penalty and Willian not booked. Even Gary Neville thought it was a foul, so it absolutely must have been.

I’m not that bothered who wins, just that VAR is completely shit.

[BR0B0T]

Willian dived.

Can't exactly rem the Maguire foot to the nuts...he shouldn't have his foot up,

...maybe you can argue defending himself when on the ground, would have to see again

He pushed William over

He was offside

[URZZZZ]

The Willian one has contact, but not sure there’s enough to do down which is another discussion for itself

The Maguire one wasn’t a red card, just like the Son one wasn’t a few weeks ago against Chelsea

Chelsea’s first has obvious contact, not sure if Fred pushed Azpilicueta in the first place though

Obviously Giroud’s was offside

Not sure VAR was too wrong today

[Old Man Andrews]

The Willian one has contact, but not sure there’s enough to do down which is another discussion for itself

The Maguire one wasn’t a red card, just like the Son one wasn’t a few weeks ago against Chelsea

Chelsea’s first has obvious contact, not sure if Fred pushed Azpilicueta in the first place though

Obviously Giroud’s was offside

Not sure VAR was too wrong today

Good god you've got even worse..........

[Franchise FC]

The Willian one has contact, but not sure there’s enough to do down which is another discussion for itself

The Maguire one wasn’t a red card, just like the Son one wasn’t a few weeks ago against Chelsea

Chelsea’s first has obvious contact, not sure if Fred pushed Azpilicueta in the first place though

Obviously Giroud’s was offside

Not sure VAR was too wrong today

We're all entitled to an opinion.
Mine seems to agree with both ex-Man Utd pundits that :
1. Challenge on Willian was a foul, but it was never checked on VAR so VAR can't be blamed or praised for that one
2. Maguire kick was clearly violent conduct and should have been a straight red. VAR most definitely wrong in that case (according to the three of us)

As for the others :
1. Fred pushed Azpilicueta first. Goal rightly disallowed, but a penalty should have been given. Don't think VAR got that right
2. Giroud was offside - no problem with that

So, as far as I can tell, VAR got one right out of three, so you're statement that 'Not sure VAR was too wrong' should have been 'VAR was two wrong'

All in my opinion, of course, but clearly supported by the commentator, co-commentator and the panel of pundits.