Football - The Covid Years

Mr Optimist
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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Mr Optimist » 13 Oct 2020 08:34

Kitsondinho It is an awful deal. The bailout looks good on paper, but with the ability of the top 6 clubs to change the way the money is distributed on a whim, they’ll have changed the terms within 2 seasons. It is nothing more than a power grab by the richest clubs in the country. Far from saving the pyramid, it will kill it. Why is this deal being floated now? They had no interest in ‘saving’ the EFL two years ago.... I hope this goes the same way (and as quickly) as the ridiculous 39th game...Sadly it seems many EFL clubs are being blinded by the short term monetary salvation. It isn’t worth it.


Absolutely. It is like a heroin dealer praying on someone, waiting until their life feels hopeless and worthless enough that they are vulnerable enough to accept their proposition, that they would normally laugh off. This plan has been three years in the making, don’t forget, why wait until now when football outside of the greed league is on its arse for it to see the light of day?

I just wish the so called big six would oxford off to join the European super league With no relegation or promotion that they want to do ultimately, and leave the rest of football to carry on without them. When Man Yoo have had 10 years of being effectively the Harlem Globetrotters of European football I hope they are still enjoying themselves beyond some people watching on tv in Asia.

I had hoped Covid 19 would act as a financial wake up call and re-set for the game, but instead we have the Orwellian some men are more equal than others attitude of the big clubs of the English game when the rest of football needs their help in a time of crisis. I’m getting more and more comfortable with the idea of just walking away from being interested in the professional game in this country. It’s their ball and they can Oxford off home if they want to.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Sutekh » 13 Oct 2020 13:48

Mr Optimist
Kitsondinho It is an awful deal. The bailout looks good on paper, but with the ability of the top 6 clubs to change the way the money is distributed on a whim, they’ll have changed the terms within 2 seasons. It is nothing more than a power grab by the richest clubs in the country. Far from saving the pyramid, it will kill it. Why is this deal being floated now? They had no interest in ‘saving’ the EFL two years ago.... I hope this goes the same way (and as quickly) as the ridiculous 39th game...Sadly it seems many EFL clubs are being blinded by the short term monetary salvation. It isn’t worth it.


Absolutely. It is like a heroin dealer praying on someone, waiting until their life feels hopeless and worthless enough that they are vulnerable enough to accept their proposition, that they would normally laugh off. This plan has been three years in the making, don’t forget, why wait until now when football outside of the greed league is on its arse for it to see the light of day?

I just wish the so called big six would oxford off to join the European super league With no relegation or promotion that they want to do ultimately, and leave the rest of football to carry on without them. When Man Yoo have had 10 years of being effectively the Harlem Globetrotters of European football I hope they are still enjoying themselves beyond some people watching on tv in Asia.

I had hoped Covid 19 would act as a financial wake up call and re-set for the game, but instead we have the Orwellian some men are more equal than others attitude of the big clubs of the English game when the rest of football needs their help in a time of crisis. I’m getting more and more comfortable with the idea of just walking away from being interested in the professional game in this country. It’s their ball and they can Oxford off home if they want to.


While I agree with the wish the big clubs would all naff off and play with themselves somewhere, sadly it’d mean TV companies all falling over themselves to be able to broadcast that league/competition and masses of many punters taking subscriptions out for it, so all the domestic leagues would only get offered paltry TV deals largely not worth considering. Of course that would mean a complete reboot of the domestic game which may not be too bad in the long term but how many clubs (and fans) would just fold or give up on the game with no way to get to the very highest level?

I said it at the time and I’ll say it again that the creation of the Premier League was the worst thing that ever happened to the game in this country. But as it’s here now under no circumstances should more voting rights ever be given away.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by WestYorksRoyal » 14 Oct 2020 16:39

Sounds like the idea has been kicked to touch, but that they will look at individual proposals within it as part of a review. Probably right call. I still think something akin to what was proposed but with fairer voting systems and stronger governance would be a good outcome.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Sanguine » 14 Oct 2020 16:43

Well, thank god United and Liverpool have been put back in their box. Far from the £250m that the EFL sought, and was part of the (yes, flawed) proposal from the clubs, the PL have collectively agreed to ditch that idea and instead offer just £50m cash to Leagues One and Two, and give Championship clubs access to loans. We're saved!

This whole thing is an exercise in 21st century outrage as a substitute for proper discussion.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by BR0B0T » 14 Oct 2020 17:56

Sanguine Well, thank god United and Liverpool have been put back in their box. Far from the £250m that the EFL sought, and was part of the (yes, flawed) proposal from the clubs, the PL have collectively agreed to ditch that idea and instead offer just £50m cash to Leagues One and Two, and give Championship clubs access to loans. We're saved!

This whole thing is an exercise in 21st century outrage as a substitute for proper discussion.


you want to give control of the prem to 6 clubs...one of which is run by the Glazers

they want to ditch the community shield and league cup so they can play more friendlies

would understand if they ditched the games to improve the quality of the product


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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Sanguine » 15 Oct 2020 08:58

BR0B0T
Sanguine Well, thank god United and Liverpool have been put back in their box. Far from the £250m that the EFL sought, and was part of the (yes, flawed) proposal from the clubs, the PL have collectively agreed to ditch that idea and instead offer just £50m cash to Leagues One and Two, and give Championship clubs access to loans. We're saved!

This whole thing is an exercise in 21st century outrage as a substitute for proper discussion.


you want to give control of the prem to 6 clubs...one of which is run by the Glazers

they want to ditch the community shield and league cup so they can play more friendlies

would understand if they ditched the games to improve the quality of the product


No I don't. As I posted earlier on this. What I don't want though is a football populace so closed off to one element of the proposals that they end up losing all of the other 80% of it, which is pretty much what has happened. The deal now on the table for EFL clubs, and specifically for Championship clubs, is significantly inferior.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Mr Angry » 20 Oct 2020 14:04

With Project Big Picture scuppered, it would appear that Liverpool and Man Utd are moving closer towards joining a "European Premier League" it has been reported this afternoon.......

https://news.sky.com/story/top-english- ... e-12109175


Liverpool and Manchester United are in talks about a bombshell plot involving Europe's biggest football clubs to join a new FIFA-backed tournament that would reshape the sport's global landscape.

Sky News has learnt that financiers are assembling a $6bn (£4.6bn) funding package to assist the creation of what could become known as the European Premier League.

More than a dozen teams from England, France, Germany, Italy and Spain are in negotiations about becoming founder members of the competition.

As many as five English clubs could sign up to join it, with a provisional start date said to have been discussed as early as 2022.

Sources said that FIFA, football's world governing body, had been involved in developing the new format, which is expected to comprise up to 18 teams, and involve fixtures played during the regular European season.

The top-placed teams in the league would then play in a knockout format to conclude the tournament, with prize money for the winners expected to be worth hundreds of millions of pounds each year.

One football industry figure said that a formal announcement about the plans was possible as soon as the end of this month, although on Tuesday a number of key details - including the full list of participating clubs - had yet to be finalised and the plans could still fall apart.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by windermereROYAL » 20 Oct 2020 18:35

Well that will be fun if the same teams are guaranteed European football every year, what`s the point in the domestic league if this happens?
Hope the fans boycott it.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Sutekh » 20 Oct 2020 19:11

Mr Angry With Project Big Picture scuppered, it would appear that Liverpool and Man Utd are moving closer towards joining a "European Premier League" it has been reported this afternoon.......

https://news.sky.com/story/top-english- ... e-12109175


Liverpool and Manchester United are in talks about a bombshell plot involving Europe's biggest football clubs to join a new FIFA-backed tournament that would reshape the sport's global landscape.

Sky News has learnt that financiers are assembling a $6bn (£4.6bn) funding package to assist the creation of what could become known as the European Premier League.

More than a dozen teams from England, France, Germany, Italy and Spain are in negotiations about becoming founder members of the competition.

As many as five English clubs could sign up to join it, with a provisional start date said to have been discussed as early as 2022.

Sources said that FIFA, football's world governing body, had been involved in developing the new format, which is expected to comprise up to 18 teams, and involve fixtures played during the regular European season.

The top-placed teams in the league would then play in a knockout format to conclude the tournament, with prize money for the winners expected to be worth hundreds of millions of pounds each year.

One football industry figure said that a formal announcement about the plans was possible as soon as the end of this month, although on Tuesday a number of key details - including the full list of participating clubs - had yet to be finalised and the plans could still fall apart.


Well if that happens good riddance to them and I won’t be wasting money watching any of it. A crappy league with no relegation and an end of season tournament to decide who wins it when you’ve just spent the whole season deciding who wins it!

Interesting to see how the proper supporters of the clubs will take to it, will they be up in arms complaining or will they just follow like sheep.


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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Stranded » 21 Oct 2020 18:57

Mr Angry With Project Big Picture scuppered, it would appear that Liverpool and Man Utd are moving closer towards joining a "European Premier League" it has been reported this afternoon.......

https://news.sky.com/story/top-english- ... e-12109175


Liverpool and Manchester United are in talks about a bombshell plot involving Europe's biggest football clubs to join a new FIFA-backed tournament that would reshape the sport's global landscape.

Sky News has learnt that financiers are assembling a $6bn (£4.6bn) funding package to assist the creation of what could become known as the European Premier League.

More than a dozen teams from England, France, Germany, Italy and Spain are in negotiations about becoming founder members of the competition.

As many as five English clubs could sign up to join it, with a provisional start date said to have been discussed as early as 2022.

Sources said that FIFA, football's world governing body, had been involved in developing the new format, which is expected to comprise up to 18 teams, and involve fixtures played during the regular European season.

The top-placed teams in the league would then play in a knockout format to conclude the tournament, with prize money for the winners expected to be worth hundreds of millions of pounds each year.

One football industry figure said that a formal announcement about the plans was possible as soon as the end of this month, although on Tuesday a number of key details - including the full list of participating clubs - had yet to be finalised and the plans could still fall apart.


Amazing how this move to an American style league is being headed up by Americans.

It will be popular for global TV but clearly half the teams will have nothing to play for after 75% of games, so the hope must be that enough people are drawn into watching Man Utd v Juventus and not notice it is a 14th v 15th dead rubber.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by John Madejski's Wallet » 22 Oct 2020 23:17

Letting the big teams fukk off and leave the rest of us alone is long overdue.

I think they'll have a big shock coming when viewing figures drop off and the 'new' prem league turns out to be awesome

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Winston Biscuit » 23 Oct 2020 07:54

CL is more exciting (though it has lost some of it's appeal in recent years) as the teams don't meet very often. All of them playing each other twice a year will very soon lose it's appeal

Traditional big teams who then become the mediocre teams in this new format and can't compete for the title will soon begin not enjoying it (Dortmund, Napoli etc). Similarly the 3rd best French team or the Portuguese teams invited in would be swapping challenging for titles to fighting relegation.

No demand driven by fans for this. While there would be an interest in it I can see the PL retaining more interest here and the better teams left behind might actually do quite well out of it and for the fans it would be less top end heavy so could actually be quite exciting.

Why are Spurs included in any conversations around a 'big 6'? WTF have they done to ever get in that conversation? The whole idea of Spurs being a 'massive club' will forever baffle me

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Winston Biscuit » 23 Oct 2020 10:29

Late to the party probably, but WTF is goal music and stadium announcers about in empty stadiums?!


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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Sanguine » 23 Oct 2020 10:53

Something I've thought on the 'Box Office' matches. Sky and BT announce their live fixtures only a couple of months ahead. There is an opportunity for Box Office games to be manipulated going forward, and crucially (and cynically) in the name of 'fairness', i.e. Liverpool were on Sky or BT around 30 times last season, whereas the likes of Norwich and Villa only half that. So the broadcasters can be 'fairer', put the likes of Villa on their regular subscription service more equally, and put big games on Box Office. I hope it doesn't come to that.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Sanguine » 23 Oct 2020 10:58

Winston Biscuit CL is more exciting (though it has lost some of it's appeal in recent years) as the teams don't meet very often. All of them playing each other twice a year will very soon lose it's appeal

Traditional big teams who then become the mediocre teams in this new format and can't compete for the title will soon begin not enjoying it (Dortmund, Napoli etc). Similarly the 3rd best French team or the Portuguese teams invited in would be swapping challenging for titles to fighting relegation.

No demand driven by fans for this. While there would be an interest in it I can see the PL retaining more interest here and the better teams left behind might actually do quite well out of it and for the fans it would be less top end heavy so could actually be quite exciting.

Why are Spurs included in any conversations around a 'big 6'? WTF have they done to ever get in that conversation? The whole idea of Spurs being a 'massive club' will forever baffle me


And agreed with this. All a European Premier League will do is shove a bunch of teams who don't win their domestic league into a continental league that they can't win either. Losing half of their games every season will soon get dull as fans of anyone bar Barca, Real, Bayern, Liverpool, Juventus, City and PSG.

On Spurs - I've often wondered the same. I guess they've succeeded over the years in recruiting very talented players like Lineker, Gazza, Sheringham, Hoddle, Greaves, Klinsmann - but a bit like Leeds it has always felt like a 'big club' badge based wholly on a golden period in the 50s/60s (the Nicholson era). Not that it particularly bothers me - just in terms of history they seem to me smaller than an Everton or a Villa, for example.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Winston Biscuit » 23 Oct 2020 11:21

My point above about it not being exciting when these clubs play each other every week got me thinking about how it does feel exciting and a novelty when some big teams in Europe meet having not done so for years, and so I wondered which giants of the game have not met for yonks?

For some reason the first I thought of was Man Utd VS Bayern Munich. Can't remember the last time they played each other. Chelsea Vs Real Madrid the same. Man City vs Inter Milan too.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Sanguine » 23 Oct 2020 11:54

Winston Biscuit My point above about it not being exciting when these clubs play each other every week got me thinking about how it does feel exciting and a novelty when some big teams in Europe meet having not done so for years, and so I wondered which giants of the game have not met for yonks?

For some reason the first I thought of was Man Utd VS Bayern Munich. Can't remember the last time they played each other. Chelsea Vs Real Madrid the same. Man City vs Inter Milan too.


1999, shirley?

City have actually never played Inter in a competitive match. Not of the same scale but maybe more surprising, Liverpool have never met Rangers in a competitive game.

Edit: So United also played Bayern in the CL QFs in 2004, 2010 and 2014. They've not met Dortmund however since the 1997 semi-final, or Atletico Madrid since 1992.

Chelsea played Real in the 1998 Super Cup, and their only other tie was the 1971 Cup Winners' Cup final. Chelsea have never played Dortmund.

Liverpool's two CL finals in three years vs. Milan are the only times that the teams have ever met.

eurocupshistory.com for all your European match-up needs.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Whore Jackie » 23 Oct 2020 13:14

Winston Biscuit CL is more exciting (though it has lost some of it's appeal in recent years) as the teams don't meet very often. All of them playing each other twice a year will very soon lose it's appeal

Traditional big teams who then become the mediocre teams in this new format and can't compete for the title will soon begin not enjoying it (Dortmund, Napoli etc). Similarly the 3rd best French team or the Portuguese teams invited in would be swapping challenging for titles to fighting relegation.

No demand driven by fans for this.


It's being driven by FIFA though. Presumably they're after some of the bundles of cash that UEFA gets from the CL. Unsurprisingly UEFA oppose the plans.

Do actually wonder what fans of the clubs that compete in the CL make of it. Is it that big a deal or a necessary evil to gain kudos and accumulate more money and better players. Thereby improving their chances of future domestic success.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Sutekh » 23 Oct 2020 13:21

Sanguine
Winston Biscuit CL is more exciting (though it has lost some of it's appeal in recent years) as the teams don't meet very often. All of them playing each other twice a year will very soon lose it's appeal

Traditional big teams who then become the mediocre teams in this new format and can't compete for the title will soon begin not enjoying it (Dortmund, Napoli etc). Similarly the 3rd best French team or the Portuguese teams invited in would be swapping challenging for titles to fighting relegation.

No demand driven by fans for this. While there would be an interest in it I can see the PL retaining more interest here and the better teams left behind might actually do quite well out of it and for the fans it would be less top end heavy so could actually be quite exciting.

Why are Spurs included in any conversations around a 'big 6'? WTF have they done to ever get in that conversation? The whole idea of Spurs being a 'massive club' will forever baffle me


And agreed with this. All a European Premier League will do is shove a bunch of teams who don't win their domestic league into a continental league that they can't win either. Losing half of their games every season will soon get dull as fans of anyone bar Barca, Real, Bayern, Liverpool, Juventus, City and PSG.

On Spurs - I've often wondered the same. I guess they've succeeded over the years in recruiting very talented players like Lineker, Gazza, Sheringham, Hoddle, Greaves, Klinsmann - but a bit like Leeds it has always felt like a 'big club' badge based wholly on a golden period in the 50s/60s (the Nicholson era). Not that it particularly bothers me - just in terms of history they seem to me smaller than an Everton or a Villa, for example.


Not sure if it’s clear anywhere but I believe this proposed European Premier League is a midweek thing so all the invited clubs would still be expected to fulfil domestic league fixtures. It is therefore going to effectively be a “closed shop Champions League” with most of the league champions across Europe not playing in it!

As mentioned UEFA are reportedly opposed to the idea - but that’s probably nothing that a few more coins heading their way couldn’t take care of.

And so then we can probably all kiss goodbye to the invited clubs ever putting some semblance of a first team squad out in domestic cup competitions presuming those competitions survive in their present form of course.

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Re: Football - The Covid Years

by Winston Biscuit » 23 Oct 2020 13:59

Chuckled earlier as I heard it suggested that rather than play boring crowd noises on telly for matches they should look to play some really intense crowd noises. If you are going to fake it then you make as well fake it with something good.

West Brom Vs Burnley with the sound effects of the Istanbul derby played over it. I would be right bang up for that! :lol:

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