Squad for 2020/21

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NewCorkSeth
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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 05 Aug 2020 15:37

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True. It’s would be great to live in a world where we bring through plenty of talent they become first team regulars and that’s the basis of our team but we don’t, how long do you stick with an academy player just in case they become good? Or as you say keep them on the books, hardly play them and hinder their development and future.

There comes a time where the club has to decide whether they are going to give a player that first team regular football or release the player, as hard as it is.

Or do what the big clubs do and put a buy back clause in. We are producing a lot of amazing talent for league 1 that then gets swallowed up by our rivals. I don’t know why we don’t do that more. Let’s say when we sold Dickie to Oxford we had put a 1 million buy back clause in we would not be looking at 5 million to get him back and him likely going to a rival.


Buyback clauses are not allowed. I believe you are allowed to have a clause allowing you to match any bid made but you can’t fix a price and a guarantee that you can be the buyer. You also have to factor in that there are 3 parties to a transfer and the player has to agree to move and agree terms so unless you have got them in on the deal it won’t happen. I can’t see many players agreeing that they could be forced to rejoin a club at some point for a preagreed wage.

Um. They totally are allowed and have to be for a set price not a "match the current offer". See Barcelona and Gérard Deulofeu.

Pretty sure only rule is price of buy back must be higher than price sold for.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by muirinho » 05 Aug 2020 17:13

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linkenholtroyal Or do what the big clubs do and put a buy back clause in. We are producing a lot of amazing talent for league 1 that then gets swallowed up by our rivals. I don’t know why we don’t do that more. Let’s say when we sold Dickie to Oxford we had put a 1 million buy back clause in we would not be looking at 5 million to get him back and him likely going to a rival.


Buyback clauses are not allowed. I believe you are allowed to have a clause allowing you to match any bid made but you can’t fix a price and a guarantee that you can be the buyer. You also have to factor in that there are 3 parties to a transfer and the player has to agree to move and agree terms so unless you have got them in on the deal it won’t happen. I can’t see many players agreeing that they could be forced to rejoin a club at some point for a preagreed wage.

Um. They totally are allowed and have to be for a set price not a "match the current offer". See Barcelona and Gérard Deulofeu.

Pretty sure only rule is price of buy back must be higher than price sold for.


The player also has to agree to come of course. But the real reason we don't have buy back clauses is because we're not a big enough club, with desirable enough players/

Basically you're transferring the risk of missing out on a hidden gem to the buying club. Why should they accept that? It means if he's no good they're stuck with him, but if he's good, they can't make a big profit on him, because they have to sell him back to us at an agreed price. where's the upside for them?

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Nameless » 05 Aug 2020 17:21

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linkenholtroyal Or do what the big clubs do and put a buy back clause in. We are producing a lot of amazing talent for league 1 that then gets swallowed up by our rivals. I don’t know why we don’t do that more. Let’s say when we sold Dickie to Oxford we had put a 1 million buy back clause in we would not be looking at 5 million to get him back and him likely going to a rival.


Buyback clauses are not allowed. I believe you are allowed to have a clause allowing you to match any bid made but you can’t fix a price and a guarantee that you can be the buyer. You also have to factor in that there are 3 parties to a transfer and the player has to agree to move and agree terms so unless you have got them in on the deal it won’t happen. I can’t see many players agreeing that they could be forced to rejoin a club at some point for a preagreed wage.

Um. They totally are allowed and have to be for a set price not a "match the current offer". See Barcelona and Gérard Deulofeu.

Pretty sure only rule is price of buy back must be higher than price sold for.


Sorry, I was only using what is contained in the EFL. Rules

Buy-back clauses. The EFL do not accept buy back clauses in financial agreements, however, it is acceptable to have an option to match any offer that another club makes for that player.

I guess they must be wrong.....

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 05 Aug 2020 17:41

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Buyback clauses are not allowed. I believe you are allowed to have a clause allowing you to match any bid made but you can’t fix a price and a guarantee that you can be the buyer. You also have to factor in that there are 3 parties to a transfer and the player has to agree to move and agree terms so unless you have got them in on the deal it won’t happen. I can’t see many players agreeing that they could be forced to rejoin a club at some point for a preagreed wage.

Um. They totally are allowed and have to be for a set price not a "match the current offer". See Barcelona and Gérard Deulofeu.

Pretty sure only rule is price of buy back must be higher than price sold for.


The player also has to agree to come of course. But the real reason we don't have buy back clauses is because we're not a big enough club, with desirable enough players/

Basically you're transferring the risk of missing out on a hidden gem to the buying club. Why should they accept that? It means if he's no good they're stuck with him, but if he's good, they can't make a big profit on him, because they have to sell him back to us at an agreed price. where's the upside for them?

Upside is the club usually buys them for a much lower price than they would have to if the buy back clause wasn't there. Clubs without major financial power get to have a player they want play for them for less of a transfer fee and will make a profit on his sale if he does move back to his original club. Its lower risk essentially.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 05 Aug 2020 17:43

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Buyback clauses are not allowed. I believe you are allowed to have a clause allowing you to match any bid made but you can’t fix a price and a guarantee that you can be the buyer. You also have to factor in that there are 3 parties to a transfer and the player has to agree to move and agree terms so unless you have got them in on the deal it won’t happen. I can’t see many players agreeing that they could be forced to rejoin a club at some point for a preagreed wage.

Um. They totally are allowed and have to be for a set price not a "match the current offer". See Barcelona and Gérard Deulofeu.

Pretty sure only rule is price of buy back must be higher than price sold for.


Sorry, I was only using what is contained in the EFL. Rules

Buy-back clauses. The EFL do not accept buy back clauses in financial agreements, however, it is acceptable to have an option to match any offer that another club makes for that player.

I guess they must be wrong.....

Sozmonauts. Thought it was a blanket statement.


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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Hendo » 06 Aug 2020 05:42

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linkenholtroyal The one CB I wish we hadn’t sold was Sean Morrison what a leader he has been for Cardiff since. He would have been a main stay in the squad from when he left to now. Always highly rated him and a true leader.

If you look at the CBs we've let go it's depressing.

Hector, Morrison, Cooper.

And in their place we've had Moore, Ilori, Blackett etc.


Think it’s a bit harsh to say we “let” Hector go. When Chelsea come calling you’re not going to be able to really hold onto that player. Also didn’t Morrison go to Cardiff when we got relegated and they got promoted? Which, I guess, you can also say is fair enough.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by SCIAG » 06 Aug 2020 06:40

Hendo
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linkenholtroyal The one CB I wish we hadn’t sold was Sean Morrison what a leader he has been for Cardiff since. He would have been a main stay in the squad from when he left to now. Always highly rated him and a true leader.

If you look at the CBs we've let go it's depressing.

Hector, Morrison, Cooper.

And in their place we've had Moore, Ilori, Blackett etc.


Think it’s a bit harsh to say we “let” Hector go. When Chelsea come calling you’re not going to be able to really hold onto that player. Also didn’t Morrison go to Cardiff when we got relegated and they got promoted? Which, I guess, you can also say is fair enough.

We sold Morrison when we sold Le Fondre and McCarthy, after we missed out on the playoffs, because the alternative was administration.

If we hadn’t sold him then Hector wouldn’t have had the same opportunity to come through.

Yes he has done well for himself but a good decision.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by linkenholtroyal » 06 Aug 2020 11:48

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Buyback clauses are not allowed. I believe you are allowed to have a clause allowing you to match any bid made but you can’t fix a price and a guarantee that you can be the buyer. You also have to factor in that there are 3 parties to a transfer and the player has to agree to move and agree terms so unless you have got them in on the deal it won’t happen. I can’t see many players agreeing that they could be forced to rejoin a club at some point for a preagreed wage.

Um. They totally are allowed and have to be for a set price not a "match the current offer". See Barcelona and Gérard Deulofeu.

Pretty sure only rule is price of buy back must be higher than price sold for.


Sorry, I was only using what is contained in the EFL. Rules

Buy-back clauses. The EFL do not accept buy back clauses in financial agreements, however, it is acceptable to have an option to match any offer that another club makes for that player.

I guess they must be wrong.....

Fair enough its a shame that big clubs can do it and we cant. seems a little unfair as we have a good academy turning out good players that are keen for first team football. I suppose the other option is the Chelsea model where you keep all of them until there 25 and loan them out but I am sure financially that is not good for the club, then at 25 if they don't make the grade for our first team and sell them to league 1. maybe we are just jumping the gun a bit early to keep money turning over.

In an ideal world we would have loaned out Teddy Howe and Josh Barrett for 2 years to Blackpool and Bristol scouted them and then reassessed them on there return.
Same with DIckie, Fosu and Stacey in previous years. it does mean tying youth players down to long term contracts though and that has its own risk. Also I suppose the youth have to buy into it. If we were a premiership team it would be easier to persuade them i suppose.

have a 4 year youth contract at 18 we will farm you out to league 1 for 2 years and then you will be looking at coming into a team that is staring at relegation to league 1 all season is probably not attractive to them.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by WestYorksRoyal » 07 Aug 2020 14:03

Wonder if Osho is now regretting his decision to reject the contract given L1 and L2 just voted for a salary cap.


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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Hendo » 07 Aug 2020 14:25

WestYorksRoyal Wonder if Osho is now regretting his decision to reject the contract given L1 and L2 just voted for a salary cap.


If he wants to come back on the contract offered, I’d take him, tbh.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by URZZZZ » 07 Aug 2020 14:35

Hendo
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linkenholtroyal The one CB I wish we hadn’t sold was Sean Morrison what a leader he has been for Cardiff since. He would have been a main stay in the squad from when he left to now. Always highly rated him and a true leader.

If you look at the CBs we've let go it's depressing.

Hector, Morrison, Cooper.

And in their place we've had Moore, Ilori, Blackett etc.


Think it’s a bit harsh to say we “let” Hector go. When Chelsea come calling you’re not going to be able to really hold onto that player. Also didn’t Morrison go to Cardiff when we got relegated and they got promoted? Which, I guess, you can also say is fair enough.


I always thought we let Hector go to afford Vydra’s loan fee from Watford. Could be wrong but weren’t Clarke and Mourinho (Chelsea manager at the time) good friends?

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 07 Aug 2020 16:49

URZZZZ
Hendo
Snowflake Royal If you look at the CBs we've let go it's depressing.

Hector, Morrison, Cooper.

And in their place we've had Moore, Ilori, Blackett etc.


Think it’s a bit harsh to say we “let” Hector go. When Chelsea come calling you’re not going to be able to really hold onto that player. Also didn’t Morrison go to Cardiff when we got relegated and they got promoted? Which, I guess, you can also say is fair enough.


I always thought we let Hector go to afford Vydra’s loan fee from Watford. Could be wrong but weren’t Clarke and Mourinho (Chelsea manager at the time) good friends?

You think Chelsea are in the business of buying players for 5 million for the lolz? I mean, if any club would, I suppose it would be Chelsea.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by From Despair To Where? » 07 Aug 2020 19:05

£4m is not a lot for Chelsea but they see it as a cheap punt in the same way we saw someone like Nicky Shorey. If he makes it, he's a bargain, otherwise they loan him out for 3 years so his wages are covered and then flog him and recoup the transfer fee. It's a deal with almost zero risk for them.

In Hector's case, they sold him for £8m.


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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 07 Aug 2020 19:58

From Despair To Where? £4m is not a lot for Chelsea but they see it as a cheap punt in the same way we saw someone like Nicky Shorey. If he makes it, he's a bargain, otherwise they loan him out for 3 years so his wages are covered and then flog him and recoup the transfer fee. It's a deal with almost zero risk for them.

In Hector's case, they sold him for £8m.

Chelsea always make a profit. The point was they wanted him. It wasn't some "hey buddy we cant afford our top target. Can you buy one of our players please?" Kinda thing.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Sutekh » 08 Aug 2020 20:27

NewCorkSeth
From Despair To Where? £4m is not a lot for Chelsea but they see it as a cheap punt in the same way we saw someone like Nicky Shorey. If he makes it, he's a bargain, otherwise they loan him out for 3 years so his wages are covered and then flog him and recoup the transfer fee. It's a deal with almost zero risk for them.

In Hector's case, they sold him for £8m.

Chelsea always make a profit. The point was they wanted him. It wasn't some "hey buddy we cant afford our top target. Can you buy one of our players please?" Kinda thing.


Wonder how Hector will do in the PL next season.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 09 Aug 2020 08:23

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NewCorkSeth
From Despair To Where? £4m is not a lot for Chelsea but they see it as a cheap punt in the same way we saw someone like Nicky Shorey. If he makes it, he's a bargain, otherwise they loan him out for 3 years so his wages are covered and then flog him and recoup the transfer fee. It's a deal with almost zero risk for them.

In Hector's case, they sold him for £8m.

Chelsea always make a profit. The point was they wanted him. It wasn't some "hey buddy we cant afford our top target. Can you buy one of our players please?" Kinda thing.


Wonder how Hector will do in the PL next season.

Decent? I hope well but Fulham are a bit ropey.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by windermereROYAL » 09 Aug 2020 10:46

I see Leeds are interested in Ben White and WBA for Shane Duffy, both Brighton CBs, wonder if they might want another punt at Liam Moore, pretty please.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by NewCorkSeth » 09 Aug 2020 11:20

windermereROYAL I see Leeds are interested in Ben White and WBA for Shane Duffy, both Brighton CBs, wonder if they might want another punt at Liam Moore, pretty please.

Leeds are not getting Ben White.

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by leon » 13 Aug 2020 09:15

Right so I haven’t been paying attention at all.

Who’s left the club?

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Re: Squad for 2020/21

by Nameless » 13 Aug 2020 09:19

leon Right so I haven’t been paying attention at all.

Who’s left the club?


Paul Holsgrove, Danny Bailey, Bomber Reeves and George Legg
Possibly others.

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