Thames Sports Investment

[melonhead]

I don't disagree with you though, this could well be good for the club

Rich benefactors (whatever nationality) don't seem to work these days. In fact SJM is perhaps one of the few that did

The new group is not like SJM - they are a faceless consortium (TSI) which can go broke just like any other limited Company - we only know two people who work for this "group".

It is better he sold now and managed the transition, but as Baines also pointed out about 50 pages back, he may have been under pressure to sell from his interests outside the club.

I'm just more concerned about the greeting of the new Messiah. I'm happy to welcome him, but won't hail him as such yet.

He may just be a very naughty boy, given the track records of other Messiahs

TSI may be a "faceless consortium" to us, but I am guessing they are not to SJM.
It was suggested early that a DM scoop prompted the outing of this deal ahead of their intended release date- that is plausable. It is unlike SJM to conduct business in public, however it is great to know of the HoA. It also apparently has convinced JK to commit- and who knows who else it might be being dangled in front of....
For those unaware of the term, it is a statement of agreement of the deal they want. It will contain details of funds, responsibilities, expectations- and evidence based. I cannot imagine SJM signing on a promise that funds will appear.
He will also be around (as will everyone else) to oversee what happens. He is not known for taking excessive risks, and I can see no way he would be talking to people who think it a good idea to mortgage/sell the ground to have a pop at CL football. Nor can I see Nicky Hammond suddenly spending £5m on an unknown son of a arms dealer, who never seems to make the bench.

For the record, many on here seem to confuse "Due Diligence" with some sort of "fit and proper" test. It isn't. Due Diligence is a task undertaken by lawyers and accountants that is essentially going through all the books and contracts and ensuring that things are as they have been presented.
SJM will have valued the club based on the assets and liabilities- an army of pen pushers will be checking that these are accurate, making sure they are aware of add-on clauses, on-going payments due on previous transfers....that the photocopiers are owned and not leased. Both sides will be making sure that there are no nasty surprises.

<<Pedant mode on>>
SJM was born in Stoke and named John HUrst. He changed his name. He is as Polish as my left gonad.
<<Pedant mode off>>

did your left gonad have a polish father?

[mr_number]

With Maccy D being given "the exact transfer budget" he asked for, but "not being allowed to break the wage structure", will he do the thing you used to be able to do on Champ Man, and offer massive signing on bonuses to make up for a short fall in wages?

That's how Stoke keep their wage structure in place.

Really? I was mainly being facetious. Didn't really consider it a feasible financial model, but I guess it depends on the balance of the figures.

[melonhead]

<<Pedant mode on>>
SJM was born in Stoke and named John HUrst. He changed his name. He is as Polish as my left gonad.
<<Pedant mode off>>

did your left gonad have a polish father?

Stepfather would be more pertinent which I guess is the point TB is making.

aaaahhhhhh

i see

carry on

[FiNeRaIn]

With Maccy D being given "the exact transfer budget" he asked for, but "not being allowed to break the wage structure", will he do the thing you used to be able to do on Champ Man, and offer massive signing on bonuses to make up for a short fall in wages?

lol, if only!

[Uke]

I was boring the missus yday with exactly this - spunking half a million on Sean Evers doesn't represent any kind of prudence.

You were thinking of Sean Evers while drilling your missus?

Even if you weren't this image will be there next time...

[Bandini]

Non-binding in terms of the deal itself, but there will often be parts of it which have the effect of binding the parties to doing something or other.

[Uke]

Non-binding in terms of the deal itself, but there will often be parts of it which have the effect of binding the parties to doing something or other.

^^'greed

There will be tasks that need to be completed and in a certain timeframe

[Silver Fox]

I was boring the missus yday with exactly this - spunking half a million on Sean Evers doesn't represent any kind of prudence.

Personally I always felt the prudence thing was born as much out of Madejski's coffers emptying over time as much as any real business ideals.

I thought it was born out of the Burns/Evers way being a gigantic fail

[mr_number]

Right, enough ideal speculation, when are we going to get today's exciting news?
After all the drama yesterday, I'd hate to think that we are going back to being one of those boring clubs where days go by without anything big happening.

Anyone hanging round Pizza Hut in the retail park today by any chance?

[muddyfeet]

apparently within the next 48 hours

[Yorkshire Royal]

With Maccy D being given "the exact transfer budget" he asked for, but "not being allowed to break the wage structure", will he do the thing you used to be able to do on Champ Man, and offer massive signing on bonuses to make up for a short fall in wages?

That's how Stoke keep their wage structure in place.

Do they pay it all upfront, or is some held back as a loyalty bonus?

Take Kenwyne Jones for example. If you believe Stoke's wage cap is 30k a week (I believe it to be more than that, but I don't know, that's the figure quoted normally). He was on 60k at Sunderland. So Stoke pay Sunderland 8m and then Sunderland assist with his "wages" by then agreeing to paying the player a "goodbye present". They front load the fee and then some of the fee essentially gets passed to the player. For all intents and purposes, a signing on fee.

I would expect a similar deal was done with Spurs for Crouch and Palacios as well. Whether this is a viable business plan long term is hard to say. Stoke certainly intend to invest the money up front when needed (they have the money) with a long term aim of making the club "self sufficient". So the wage cap is a key part of this.

[mr_number]

apparently within the next 48 hours

You'll be hanging round PH within the next 48 hours?

[Vision]

That's how Stoke keep their wage structure in place.

Do they pay it all upfront, or is some held back as a loyalty bonus?

Take Kenwyne Jones for example. If you believe Stoke's wage cap is 30k a week (I believe it to be more than that, but I don't know, that's the figure quoted normally). He was on 60k at Sunderland. So Stoke pay Sunderland 8m and then Sunderland assist with his "wages" by then agreeing to paying the player a "goodbye present". They front load the fee and then some of the fee essentially gets passed to the player. For all intents and purposes, a signing on fee.

I would expect a similar deal was done with Spurs for Crouch and Palacios as well. Whether this is a viable business plan long term is hard to say. Stoke certainly intend to invest the money up front when needed (they have the money) with a long term aim of making the club "self sufficient". So the wage cap is a key part of this.

Wonder how that would effect renegotiating existing players' contracts.

Also wonder how that shows up in an accounting sense.

[melonhead]

Indeed but equally with higher rewards now though.

But one that was more necessary to make given the massive investment we'd made in a stadium that was then half empty and we needed to get significantly fuller to pay for. So the consequences of not doing it were fairly hefty.

And I'd argue we learnt a fairly good lesson in doing it as well given how much money we spent on utter dross under Burns. Pardew had to really earn the ability to spend decent money. How much did Pardew spend before getting us promoted? I'd hazard a guess it wasn't nearly as much as Burns did.

Not much to choose between them to be honest and the first influx of Burns buys were in the 2nd tier albeit at the bottom of it. The stadium attendance factor would play a role of course but i think you're overplaying slightly. I could be wrong on this I seem to remember that attendances barely rose at all on promotion back to the championship until the final stages of the season when the play offs beckoned.

I suspected the prospective added revenue from ITV Digital would have played just as big a factor. Money which we never actually had/got but still budgeted for and something that I think changed Madejski's outlook from then on.

Bottom line though is we ran up significant losses in an attempt to get out of the division on the back of the liquidity of the owner. A calculated risk but hardly prudence and as Zac says to suggest we've always been some paragon of fiscal virtue is rewriting history somewhat.

isnt this just part of the picture-along with our time in and relegation from the prem, with all of this helping form madejskis later view that the current football model is unsustainable and prudence is teh way forward.
no ones saying hes always felt that way are they?

[Barry the bird boggler]

Watched the conference. You cannot fault in anyway the sentiment or the intended operation. It certainly sounds great, let's just hope that that little bit of good fortune you also need to get promoted and stop it being so much of a lottery is not too far away.

[loyalroyal4life]

I dont know how anyone can see this as being too good to be true when our 2 marquee signings are Jason Roberts and 'I've got a girls name' Osborne

[melonhead]

i see that simpy as a sign that these people arent dicks, and McD and co still have their heads screwed on



add in ciwka from derby confirmed on twitter( ) and id be really happy with our january business

[Scylla]

I was boring the missus yday with exactly this - spunking half a million on Sean Evers doesn't represent any kind of prudence.

Personally I always felt the prudence thing was born as much out of Madejski's coffers emptying over time as much as any real business ideals.

I thought it was born out of the Burns/Evers way being a gigantic fail

Someone will no doubt put me straight but I thought that a fair amount was spent getting into the Premier League. it was the cost of staying there plus the credit squeeze that really scared the shit out of him.

[melonhead]

whole squad slightly less that 5 million quid in 05/06
only added seol for 1-1.5 in 06/07

top wage was 15 k a week if i remember rightly

[ZacNaloen]

But losing 6million a year as well, it's the wages that were killer.

We built the squad from basic principles, but paid them well to keep the ones that turned good.