Hat-tricks

[ayjaydee]

"Perfect" hat trick as well, header, left foot, right foot.

I thought he cut in and hit it with his left for the second

[SCIAG]

Completely agree with Spacey on both Lita and Archie, they're as British as Terry Butcher or Joanna Lumley.

The first really should have been Bobby Convey against Millwall this time ten years ago, but Kitson wouldn't let him take the penalty when he was on two goals.

Just picking up on something in the OP - did Long ever actually score a competitive hat trick for us? I thought Le Fondre's two were the first since Doyle hit two in Coppell's final season.

[Ian Royal]

Completely agree with Spacey on both Lita and Archie, they're as British as Terry Butcher or Joanna Lumley.

The first really should have been Bobby Convey against Millwall this time ten years ago, but Kitson wouldn't let him take the penalty when he was on two goals.

Just picking up on something in the OP - did Long ever actually score a competitive hat trick for us? I thought Le Fondre's two were the first since Doyle hit two in Coppell's final season.

No but he scored a shed load of braces.

[From Despair To Where?]

Completely agree with Spacey on both Lita and Archie, they're as British as Terry Butcher or Joanna Lumley.

I'd disagree. Butcher and Lumley were born abroad to British parents and class themselves as British.

Whilst it is unlikely that Lita would have had the career or footballing education without coming to Britain, he was born in DR Congo (OK, strictly speaking Zaire) to Congolese parents and was Congolese. He came to Britain as a kid effectively as a refugee to escape a civil war. When he was called up to England U21's there was all that hassle about him not having proof of British citizenship to get a passport.

Lovell was born in Australia and by chosing to play for Australia, defines himself as Australian.

[SCIAG]

Completely agree with Spacey on both Lita and Archie, they're as British as Terry Butcher or Joanna Lumley.

I'd disagree. Butcher and Lumley were born abroad to British parents and class themselves as British.

Whilst it is unlikely that Lita would have had the career or footballing education without coming to Britain, he was born in DR Congo (OK, strictly speaking Zaire) to Congolese parents and was Congolese. He came to Britain as a kid effectively as a refugee to escape a civil war. When he was called up to England U21's there was all that hassle about him not having proof of British citizenship to get a passport.

Lovell was born in Australia and by chosing to play for Australia, defines himself as Australian.

Well first up, I think there's something very different about bringing over a foreign player as opposed to using a dual national who happens to live in the country anyway. I know that isn't what Spacey asked about.

Not sure you can have it both ways and say that Lovell's Australian because he plays for them but Lita isn't English even though he chose to play for England.

Some people (Dave Kitson, James Harper) feel very strongly about not playing for a country that they don't define themselves as, others don't and will play for anyone to get international football (Andy Townsend, Alex Pearce, Pepe, Hal Robson-Kanu). Try telling Jason Roberts that playing football for a second-rate Caribbean nation means he isn't English. A footballer's choice of international team usually isn't a sign that they reject all others, it's usually a calculated move to increase their chances of international glory.

[TBM]

I used to play football with Archie's brother - he most definitely classed himself as Austrailian so I'm not sure why you say "he's English"

[Franchise FC]

I used to play football with Archie's brother - he most definitely classed himself as Austrailian so I'm not sure why you say "he's English"

I don't remember asking Shovel what his nationality is but I do remember he was good at handstands, so clearly an Aussie

[SCIAG]

I'm not sure why you say "he's English"

Nobody has said he's English, just that foreign-born people growing up in Britain aren't as foreign as Orlando Sa.

[Ian Royal]

I'm not sure why you say "he's English"

Nobody has said he's English, just that foreign-born people growing up in Britain aren't as foreign as Orlando Sa.

So now you're arguing about what degree of foreignness qualifies you? Is 3/8ths enough? 8/13ths?

[RoyallyFcuked]

I know Leroy Lita wasn't born in England but I always think of him as English, and I think he does as well.

He played for England U21s and I can also remember there was talk of him possibly getting a call up to the England first team, during his purple patch in our first Prem season.

Speaking of hat tricks, no Reading player has ever scored a top flight hat trick but Lita should have been the first man to do it our first Prem season. Remember the 2-0 away win at Man City? One of my favourite away days, he scored two well taken goals late in the game but also had one wrongly disallowed in the first half, Stephen Hunt headed the ball back across goal and Lita stabbed it in, but the ball was judged to have gone out of play when Hunt headed it back...

So that one got away, but maybe we will see the first Reading Prem hat trick next season instead...

[marcusopp]

Think that means Sa is the first player to score a hat-trick for Reading whose first language is not English.

You really need to get out more!

[SCIAG]

I'm not sure why you say "he's English"

Nobody has said he's English, just that foreign-born people growing up in Britain aren't as foreign as Orlando Sa.

So now you're arguing about what degree of foreignness qualifies you? Is 3/8ths enough? 8/13ths?

Well, it depends on your definition of "foreign", doesn't it? As Spacey was the one setting the question, it seems fair for him to also have a big say in the definition.

You could theoretically have a whole load of answers - Scottish/Welsh/Northern Irish/pre-independence Irish player (born outside England), pre-1990 Irish player (born outside the UK), Archie (born outside the British Isles - did he have British citizenship at birth?), Lita (first to not have British or Irish citizenship at birth?) or Sa (first not to be raised in the British Isles). Personally, I think they're all quite interesting.

[From Despair To Where?]

Completely agree with Spacey on both Lita and Archie, they're as British as Terry Butcher or Joanna Lumley.

I'd disagree. Butcher and Lumley were born abroad to British parents and class themselves as British.

Whilst it is unlikely that Lita would have had the career or footballing education without coming to Britain, he was born in DR Congo (OK, strictly speaking Zaire) to Congolese parents and was Congolese. He came to Britain as a kid effectively as a refugee to escape a civil war. When he was called up to England U21's there was all that hassle about him not having proof of British citizenship to get a passport.

Lovell was born in Australia and by chosing to play for Australia, defines himself as Australian.

Well first up, I think there's something very different about bringing over a foreign player as opposed to using a dual national who happens to live in the country anyway. I know that isn't what Spacey asked about.

Not sure you can have it both ways and say that Lovell's Australian because he plays for them but Lita isn't English even though he chose to play for England.

Some people (Dave Kitson, James Harper) feel very strongly about not playing for a country that they don't define themselves as, others don't and will play for anyone to get international football (Andy Townsend, Alex Pearce, Pepe, Hal Robson-Kanu). Try telling Jason Roberts that playing football for a second-rate Caribbean nation means he isn't English. A footballer's choice of international team usually isn't a sign that they reject all others, it's usually a calculated move to increase their chances of international glory.

I was referring to your comparison to Terry Butcher and Joanna Lumley which is why I quoted that part of your post only. I have no issue with Lita regarding himself as English. If Lovell wants to regard himself as Australian then you have to respect his decision. Both were born outside the British Isles, both scored hat tricks for Reading. Works for me.

[Winchester Royal]

Sa is the first player with only two letters in his name to score a hat-trick for Reading.

[Forbury Lion]

Good answer, but I'd say he isn't really Australian considering he grew up in this country.

Anyone else?

But he is from outside of the British Isles (Which was the question), even if he is eligible to play for Scotland and grew up in England.

[Forbury Lion]

Sa is the first player with only two letters in his name to score a hat-trick for Reading.

and the first player with his firstname on the back of his shirt to score a hat-trick for Reading.

[URZZZZZ]

Just stuck a tenna on sa to get another hat trick tomorrow evening at 80-1.
And 25 quid on Blackman to score at any time at 9-4.
Vydra is also 9-4
U never know

[Maguire]

Leroy Lita.

Born in a foreign country - check
English not his first language - check
..and for the little Englander double wammee, he was a refugee as well.

And a total pcunt

[From Despair To Where?]

Is that the United Pcuntdom or the Democratic Republic of Pcunts?

[Maguire]

Is that the United Pcuntdom or the Democratic Republic of Pcunts?