Madejski Announcement

[comeonyouroyals]

So can anyone give me some quick figures please? I would like to know what roughly we take from tv money, tickets sales and sponsorship and also competition money?

Because if we are spending 10mil or so on wages, about a 1mil a season on transfer fees and god knows how much in maintence costs etc then I can't see where we are making the money to cover those costs even with 11mil on player sales?

[Ian Royal]

Well 11 Mill we have got in . Time for him to be bloody honest ..Spend five of it . oh our wages are high .

Not according to Madejski it isn't.

[SouthDownsRoyal]

SIXTEEN PAGES!!!

and no news????????????????????????

[Dick Habbin's hairdo]

He may coin a few new phrases as he knows the natives are getting restless now, but essentially it will be the same message. He is not the sort of person who will bow to supporter power and will carry on doing things his way. After all, it is his club, he can do what he want.

I don't need to read anymore of this thread. This says it all. And, you know what, I'm forever bloody thankful for the Mad Man.

Yes, it is *his* club - but we wouldn't have a club without him.

I'd like some clear analysis of finances - and "projected" spending - from him purely out of interest, but I can easily live without it.

At end of the day we all support RFC because that defines who we are, where we are from and you buy into the good, the bad and the ugly.

Forty two years after seeing my first match, I can't contemplate it any other way.

[SouthDownsRoyal]

i wanted tp merge wioth oxford years ago - kassam woudl have splashed the cash

[comeonyouroyals]

So can anyone give me some quick figures please? I would like to know what roughly we take from tv money, tickets sales and sponsorship and also competition money?

Because if we are spending 10mil or so on wages, about a 1mil a season on transfer fees and god knows how much in maintence costs etc then I can't see where we are making the money to cover those costs even with 11mil on player sales?

would you like reading to go bust have no football club at all ? that why sir john keep the club blance.....madejski has done great at reading

Kinda the point I was making

[Gordons Cumming]

This thread just goes to show how immature and lacking in common sense much of HNA is.

HTH

[DOYLERSAROYALER]

Until the club are more transparent with transfer fees , there will always be this conflict between what the media say and what the club say...

.if Madejski wants the fans to believe that the club got less than quoted in the press, then the best way is to start disclosing...

..undisclosed fee has always been the "Reading way", never understood it, and Reading are one of the very few clubs that operate transfers with the fees shrouded in secrecy...

If the club wants the fans to believe them , then they are just going to have to be more open .....otherwise we'll have to continue believing the media and other sources....which will no doubt continue to p*ss Madejski off


...would also help getting people like Howe off the wage bill ...deadweights who add no value ....surely Bugs can report directly into Chairman and cut out this CE role that probably costs the club a fortune

[Barry the bird boggler]

Until the club are more transparent with transfer fees , there will always be this conflict between what the media say and what the club say...

.if Madejski wants the fans to believe that the club got less than quoted in the press, then the best way is to start disclosing...

..undisclosed fee has always been the "Reading way", never understood it, and Reading are one of the very few clubs that operate transfers with the fees shrouded in secrecy...

If the club wants the fans to believe them , then they are just going to have to be more open .....otherwise we'll have to continue believing the media and other sources....which will no doubt continue to p*ss Madejski off


...would also help getting people like Howe off the wage bill ...deadweights who add no value ....surely Bugs can report directly into Chairman and cut out this CE role that probably costs the club a fortune

Nigel Howe, I believe, looks after the day to day operation and direction of the entire organisation, remember it's not just the club (and he would not have direct input into the football side of things anyway (that's down to Brian and Nick)) it's London Irish tenancy, its the hotel, its the conference centres, merchandising etc. therefore getting rid of him would not exactly be the brightest move.

[howser]

Transfer income not as reported, no money to spend, cut the cloth accordingly same old, same old

[The Real Sandhurst Royal]

Transfer fees are often deferred by clubs and staged over two or three seasons hence the money is not available straight away... This is good for the finances providing the club you have sold the player too does not go into administartion

For example: The reported £4m fee for Mills could be staged in 3 payments

£2m - Immediate down payment
£1m - At the end of the 2011/ 2012 season or before the 2012 / 2013 season starts
£1m - Last payment, with clauses in 18 - 24 months time

[Barry the bird boggler]

Transfer fees are often deferred by clubs and staged over two or three seasons hence the money is not available straight away... This is good for the finances providing the club you have sold the player too does not go into administartion

For example: The reported £4m fee for Mills could be staged in 3 payments

£2m - Immediate down payment
£1m - At the end of the 2011/ 2012 season or before the 2012 / 2013 season starts
£1m - Last payment, with clauses in 18 - 24 months time

Plus I bet there's bits tied in about agent's comission and perhaps clauses such as n paid on appearances and x paid on promotion.

[Here for the KEBE]

I think the thing is though RR is that we were ambitious under Madejski and indeed heavy spenders in the lower divisions (particularly under Burns). I fully understand the Academy incurs significant costs and that players salaries are a massive hit for the club to bear but surely thats the same for other Championship clubs.
Six or seven years ago we were the up and coming kids on the block. Not any longer. The likes of Swansea, Soton and Brighton have overtaken us.

We had to get out of the third tier to have any chance of staying affloat with the new stadium, and to have a chance of making the Premier League. That's why we spent to get out. We couldn't afford to stay there with an average attendence of 8k-12k.

Valid point Ian although we also spent when we were promoted to the premiership,ie Leroy Lita without having to sell any players.

Exactly, the year before the promotion year was in essence a rebuilding year. The issue now is that EVERY year is a rebuilding year. The fans can take one once in a while but after a while it becomes extremely irritating.

[southbank1871]

Some points for the record. Anyone who wants to can request accounts from companies house - http://www.companieshouse.gov.uk

Firstly- RFC Holdings includes both the hotel and the results of the football club. Reading Football Club is just the club. The hotel was initially loss making and seperately loaned money from SJM. It has now profitable and has paid this back and could now potentially subsidise the club.

Secondly, SJM takes no salary, no dividends and no money out of the club other than interest on his loans of £20m. This is at a rate BELOW base rate, so is currently NIL. If anybody feels like abusing the man please ensure you would be prepared to work without any pay or reward whilst being abused in the same fashion.

Thirdly, over the last 6 years, almost every penny of our TV income from the premierleague, parachute payments and ticket revenue has been spent on players. RFC earnt approximately £60m from tv, £32m from parachutes and £40m from ticket revenues over this period and spent £130m on playing staff wages alone. Therefore all running costs of the club, stadium, training facilities and of course incoming transfer obligations are currently being met by player sales.

Fourthly transfer income is obviously paid over a number of years and dependant on numerous clauses. Therefore I think SJM makes it clear that its not as simple as spending £11m on new players, or indeed £4m. We probably can rely on an extra £2.5m a year over the next 4 or 5 years and so it is this figure that will be built into our new budgets. As we have probably budgeted to a £3m or so loss then this will result only in break even for 2011-2012, so to actually pay lots of cash for any new players right now would lead to borrowing.

Fifthly, of course this is different from most clubs, who spent either next years season ticket money (leeds, cardiff), dead peoples money that is in dispute (Soton), money borrowed against a new stadium (Brighton), Imaginary money gained by fraud (leicester) etc etc. Reading could gently pledge future cash to fund a new team but the currently strategy has given us more success than the above clubs so why change?

Sixthly, we pay our players high wages so that we attract top players and they no doubt get bonuses for all our recent success, cup runs etc, but most importantly they get high wages so they tie themselves down and can be sold for lots. An alternative would be paying lesser wages, having worse players, not need to sell them and playing in league 1. The wagebill is still big as Long and Mills will still be on it, much as Harper was the year before and Hunt and Doyle before that. Comments above the £20m is ridiculous are wide of the mark as
a) rough calculations based on football manager £xK a week do not include the 12.8% extra employees NI on all wages and the fact that bonuses are likely to have the tax paid by the company (not exactly normal but very common) which leads to a 66.67% tax rate, all of which is included in salary costs.
and b) the average championship wagebill is over £20m.

Seventhly and finally, people have asked where would we be without all these sales and surely no other champ club has brought in so much income.... well the best example is Sheffield Utd. They got a reported £25m from west ham but are now an estimated £56m in debt and of course, are in league 1. Other clubs rack up more debt each year. I did an analysis of the league in Coppell's final year and found that of the top half, only Swansea and Burnley were profitable. "wheres the money from?" would be a more appropriate chant.

Holy shit, why are people still arguing after this post?

Finerain seems to have had a stroke and completely forgotten how overpaid most footballers are.

RL - are you seriously still insinuating that JM used money obatined from player sales to pay for the hotel refurb?

[PEARCEY]

Just to clarify my Leroy Lita point....before someone knocks me down. He was bought in the season before we won promotion to the Premiership.
I realise Madejski is no longer able to plough investment into the club like he used to but for five years now he has been open about selling the club. It strikes me as odd he has yet to complete the sale by now. Clearly he cannot be realistically valuing the club. He needs to stop complaining about how football is these days. If he doesn't like it he should drop the value he places against the club and get out of football.

[brendywendy]

Secondly, SJM takes no salary, no dividends and no money out of the club other than interest on his loans of £20m. This is at a rate BELOW base rate, so is currently NIL. If anybody feels like abusing the man please ensure you would be prepared to work without any pay or reward whilst being abused in the same fashion.

I seem to recall that he owns Hogwood himself and the club pay rent - is this true?

both this, and the ammounts the hotel have lost are really very negligible compared to the ammounts of money people seem to think we should be spending. think they are both red herrings imo.

[Super Kevin Bremner!]

Some points for the record. Anyone who wants to can request accounts from companies house - http://www.companieshouse.gov.uk

Firstly- RFC Holdings includes both the hotel and the results of the football club. Reading Football Club is just the club. The hotel was initially loss making and seperately loaned money from SJM. It has now profitable and has paid this back and could now potentially subsidise the club.

Secondly, SJM takes no salary, no dividends and no money out of the club other than interest on his loans of £20m. This is at a rate BELOW base rate, so is currently NIL. If anybody feels like abusing the man please ensure you would be prepared to work without any pay or reward whilst being abused in the same fashion.

Thirdly, over the last 6 years, almost every penny of our TV income from the premierleague, parachute payments and ticket revenue has been spent on players. RFC earnt approximately £60m from tv, £32m from parachutes and £40m from ticket revenues over this period and spent £130m on playing staff wages alone. Therefore all running costs of the club, stadium, training facilities and of course incoming transfer obligations are currently being met by player sales.

Fourthly transfer income is obviously paid over a number of years and dependant on numerous clauses. Therefore I think SJM makes it clear that its not as simple as spending £11m on new players, or indeed £4m. We probably can rely on an extra £2.5m a year over the next 4 or 5 years and so it is this figure that will be built into our new budgets. As we have probably budgeted to a £3m or so loss then this will result only in break even for 2011-2012, so to actually pay lots of cash for any new players right now would lead to borrowing.

Fifthly, of course this is different from most clubs, who spent either next years season ticket money (leeds, cardiff), dead peoples money that is in dispute (Soton), money borrowed against a new stadium (Brighton), Imaginary money gained by fraud (leicester) etc etc. Reading could gently pledge future cash to fund a new team but the currently strategy has given us more success than the above clubs so why change?

Sixthly, we pay our players high wages so that we attract top players and they no doubt get bonuses for all our recent success, cup runs etc, but most importantly they get high wages so they tie themselves down and can be sold for lots. An alternative would be paying lesser wages, having worse players, not need to sell them and playing in league 1. The wagebill is still big as Long and Mills will still be on it, much as Harper was the year before and Hunt and Doyle before that. Comments above the £20m is ridiculous are wide of the mark as
a) rough calculations based on football manager £xK a week do not include the 12.8% extra employees NI on all wages and the fact that bonuses are likely to have the tax paid by the company (not exactly normal but very common) which leads to a 66.67% tax rate, all of which is included in salary costs.
and b) the average championship wagebill is over £20m.

Seventhly and finally, people have asked where would we be without all these sales and surely no other champ club has brought in so much income.... well the best example is Sheffield Utd. They got a reported £25m from west ham but are now an estimated £56m in debt and of course, are in league 1. Other clubs rack up more debt each year. I did an analysis of the league in Coppell's final year and found that of the top half, only Swansea and Burnley were profitable. "wheres the money from?" would be a more appropriate chant.

Probably the best post I have ever seen on this website and I've clocked up a good 12 years now.

The Finerain's of this World have a huge opportunity to get some credibility now by acknowledging this and backing the f*ck down.

Probably not gonna happen though.

[brendywendy]

Reading = a poor man's Everton.

and everton, a poor mans arsenal.

we arent the only ones doing business this way.
but then we also arent the only club whos fans are up in arms wanting their clubs to spend money they dont have because they dont understand the finances, or because they simply dont care, and want to support a big spending club

[cmonurz]

Can't possibly read all this thread, but can someone confirm, for my hard of understanding that based on what Madejski has said, had we not sold Long and Mills (and Gylfi last season), and Doyle etc etc, we'd be bankrupt?

I'm actually alarmed when Madejski says 'we didn't get anything like those sums' for Mills and Long. Unless the above is true, my immediate reaction is 'well why the fcuk did we sell them then?'

[brendywendy]

Well 11 Mill we have got in . Time for him to be bloody honest ..Spend five of it . oh our wages are high .

i for one welcome this new, stream of conciousness, posting style.
its very poetic