Embargos, HMRC Payment defaults, non payment of wages, the usual under Dai Wrongge

[Elm Park Kid]

The big mystery around all of this is what is going on with Dai's finances. Sure - we all know that he doesn't care about the club anymore, but is too stubborn to accept reasonable offers to sell. But he's also undermining the value of the club by not funding our key commitments on time. He has paid the tax bill eventually in previous months - but only when he's been pushed by Pang.

It's hard to believe given his status and property portfolio that he couldn't cover this £1m we now owe - which would be in his own financial, and PR interest to do so. And he'd get plenty of money back when he sells.

This isn't so much cutting off your nose to spite our face as chainsawing your head off.

Like, if he genuinely doesn't have the liquid assets in the UK due to . . whatever . . then why doesn't he just sell? I am aware that there are 100% viable offers that he has turned down, some for stupid reason.

This feels like he deliberately wants to destroy the club .

[WestYorksRoyal]

If Dai had businesses sense, he'd have sold us the moment we got relegated, before shit hit the fan and arguably when our value as
L1 club would have been greatest.

All behaviour since then has been totally irrational and suggests he's not motivated by his finances. This has been the worry all along and is coming to a head now.

[tmesis]

This feels like he deliberately wants to destroy the club .

I don't think that's right. If that was the case he could have just liquidated on a whim ages ago.

I do think that he doesn't really care any more, and just wants to offload in the way that will maximise the money he can claw back.

[WestYorksRoyal]

This feels like he deliberately wants to destroy the club .

I don't think that's right. If that was the case he could have just liquidated on a whim ages ago.

I do think that he doesn't really care any more, and just wants to offload in the way that will maximise the money he can claw back.

Well then we should have accepted the viable offers on the table in November. Maybe the middle ground is bad advice. Maybe he genuinely believes he can squeeze more money out of the stadium and the training ground without a club to go with them. He's completely wrong if so, hopefully he doesn't learn that the hard way.

[tmesis]

This feels like he deliberately wants to destroy the club .

I don't think that's right. If that was the case he could have just liquidated on a whim ages ago.

I do think that he doesn't really care any more, and just wants to offload in the way that will maximise the money he can claw back.

Well then we should have accepted the viable offers on the table in November. Maybe the middle ground is bad advice. Maybe he genuinely believes he can squeeze more money out of the stadium and the training ground without a club to go with them. He's completely wrong if so, hopefully he doesn't learn that the hard way.

Nobody really knows what the offers were back then.

Ashley apparently only wanted the stadium, and that's the bit the brings in an income for Dai, so maybe he didn't want to sell just that.

[Pepe the Horseman]

The problem is Dai cares too much. He's being overly cautious because he wants to sell to someone with our best interests at heart.

[blythspartan]

Here’s a link that’s been setup by EPR if anyone is interested.
https://t.co/WfaOJZQW3b

[WestYorksRoyal]

£5k down, £995k to go.

It needs a handful of big hitters. We'll never get there with regular fans chipping in £20 or £50 each.

[tmesis]

£5k down, £995k to go.

It needs a handful of big hitters. We'll never get there with regular fans chipping in £20 or £50 each.

We'd need to raise £70000 a day to hit £1 million by the end of the month. That's not going to happen.

It makes you wonder what the supposed big expense is this month that's made it so difficult. The cynic in me suspects a stadium rent payment, or some other money Dai is taking out of the club, but it could be any number of things

[Snowflake Royal]

This feels like he deliberately wants to destroy the club .

I don't think that's right. If that was the case he could have just liquidated on a whim ages ago.

I do think that he doesn't really care any more, and just wants to offload in the way that will maximise the money he can claw back.

I think it's simple. He doesn't care, and we won't sell for anything less than what he sees as a victory price. And he won't put more money in. So it's a question of getting someone willing to stoke his ego with a big enough payment (unlikely) or how long he club can limp on without financial support before liquidation becomes unavoidable.

Everything about Dai is ego.
Buying a football club on the edge of the PL.
Ignoring all rational football finance and spending way more than the club could afford, breaking FL rules
Refusing to sell his best player (Moore) and giving him a PL wage & refusing to sell Loader - a high profile young talent. No one is allowed to take his toys away from him.
Spending big on Puscas and Joao the second it would be permitted.
Spending big on Aluko when he couldn't get Oliveira, even though we had no need for Aluko
Appointing a former Chelsea bigwig as CEO.
He likes gambling.

It's all about prestige. But the failures don't matter, only the successes. It doesn't matter to him that Moore rots in the squad picking up huge money and leaves for nothing. It doesn't matter to him that Loader and Swift leave for nothing. The bets on them didn't work an they're cast away and forgotten. That's why his Belgium club expired for relatively minor debt. There was no prestige in them anymore, and he simply made no effort to save them.

We're oxf*rd. No amount of pressure will change him. It might provoke a bit of a response and some platitudes publicly, but ultimately it doesn't matter. He'll just ignore it when it comes to actually doing anything. Like the FL fines.

It's just all about getting wins. Selling us for what he sees as a derisory price and big loss isn't a win to him. Us being liquidated isn't a loss to him, it's just a bet that didn't succeed.

[WestYorksRoyal]

But if we're a lost bet with no prestige, why not accept £20m - £30m for us instead of going a route that leaves you with nothing? It's a lost bet either way, so may as well take a consolation prize.

[72 bus]

The Bloke has basically had his assets frozen whilst an investigation into falsely declaring securities that he did not own.
He has bigger issues to worry about than a small football club, I.E embezzlement carries the death penalty in China.
When his UK based sister handed all of her share holdings back to him as a "gift" you could see then the shit was going to hit the fan.

Read here and you can see why RFC is not on his radar at the moment.

https://www1.hkexnews.hk/listedco/listc ... 800216.pdf

[tmesis]

But if we're a lost bet with no prestige, why not accept £20m - £30m for us instead of going a route that leaves you with nothing? It's a lost bet either way, so may as well take a consolation prize.

In truth, we have no idea how much is being offered, and admitting things are desperate by putting the training ground up for sale, isn't going to make anyone increase their offer.

Indeed, some might even think it'd be better to wait until liquidation, and pick up a 'bargain'.

Oddly, that might even be our best hope, although it might depend on whether he'd liquidate the stadium company as well.

[Elm Park Kid]

The Bloke has basically had his assets frozen whilst an investigation into falsely declaring securities that he did not own.
He has bigger issues to worry about than a small football club, I.E embezzlement carries the death penalty in China.
When his UK based sister handed all of her share holdings back to him as a "gift" you could see then the shit was going to hit the fan.

Read here and you can see why RFC is not on his radar at the moment.

https://www1.hkexnews.hk/listedco/listc ... 800216.pdf

Why not just sell then? And before you say it, I have been told by very good sources who have been 100% correct so far this season that he has received fair offers and acted with complete contempt for the buyers.

[Lower West]

What usual payments would there be that wouldn’t be paid, other than money from Dai?

Ticket sales aren't going to be a lot different. Transfer fee installments aren't going to unexpectedly fluctuate as Uke says. TV money?

I've no idea, but Earnshaw has spoken to several people at the club...I'm guessing there may be the odd quarterly payment ?

Quarterly VAT payment to HMRC?

[Lower West]

I don't think that's right. If that was the case he could have just liquidated on a whim ages ago.

I do think that he doesn't really care any more, and just wants to offload in the way that will maximise the money he can claw back.

Well then we should have accepted the viable offers on the table in November. Maybe the middle ground is bad advice. Maybe he genuinely believes he can squeeze more money out of the stadium and the training ground without a club to go with them. He's completely wrong if so, hopefully he doesn't learn that the hard way.

Nobody really knows what the offers were back then.

Ashley apparently only wanted the stadium, and that's the bit the brings in an income for Dai, so maybe he didn't want to sell just that.

And Dai gets stuck with a training facility that needs to generate an income to service the attached debt. No commercial sense in such a deal. Behind the scenes the financial structure is likely to be somewhat more complex than many people are assuming.

[Stranded]

The Bloke has basically had his assets frozen whilst an investigation into falsely declaring securities that he did not own.
He has bigger issues to worry about than a small football club, I.E embezzlement carries the death penalty in China.
When his UK based sister handed all of her share holdings back to him as a "gift" you could see then the shit was going to hit the fan.

Read here and you can see why RFC is not on his radar at the moment.

https://www1.hkexnews.hk/listedco/listc ... 800216.pdf

Why not just sell then? And before you say it, I have been told by very good sources who have been 100% correct so far this season that he has received fair offers and acted with complete contempt for the buyers.

My gut tells me his pride his hurt and he just doesn't give a shiny fcuk especially with his reported other issues back in China.

He is potentially at the stage where he would rather take the business down rather than sell it on to someone else who could make a success of it. Possible that the only thing worse than running a failing business, is then seeing someone else take that business and make it successful.

Can't shake the feeling we are toast.

[WestYorksRoyal]

All we can do is try what we can to help. That means finding a way to help with the shortfall, Selles and the team doing what they can on the pitch and Howe, Bowen et. al bringing bids to the table.

I think we will actually get to the point where Dai is presented with credible deals for what is a very fair price. Then nobody has a clue what he will do.

[blythspartan]

The Bloke has basically had his assets frozen whilst an investigation into falsely declaring securities that he did not own.
He has bigger issues to worry about than a small football club, I.E embezzlement carries the death penalty in China.
When his UK based sister handed all of her share holdings back to him as a "gift" you could see then the shit was going to hit the fan.

Read here and you can see why RFC is not on his radar at the moment.

https://www1.hkexnews.hk/listedco/listc ... 800216.pdf

Why not just sell then? And before you say it, I have been told by very good sources who have been 100% correct so far this season that he has received fair offers and acted with complete contempt for the buyers.

My gut tells me his pride his hurt and he just doesn't give a shiny fcuk especially with his reported other issues back in China.

He is potentially at the stage where he would rather take the business down rather than sell it on to someone else who could make a success of it. Possible that the only thing worse than running a failing business, is then seeing someone else take that business and make it successful.

Can't shake the feeling we are toast.

I agree about the toast part.

My heart is saying we’ll be saved, but my head knows Dai isn’t a normal rational person and he’s already killed 2 clubs. Also, the reality is that once we fold it’ll soon be forgotten and Sky will be dedicating several days to Liverpool fans mourning Klopp leaving.

[WestYorksRoyal]

We've got good coverage from various quarters this season, the likes of Ian Wright and Jeff Stelling. We were headline sporting news after the abandonment.

But at our most perilous moment, there's not much being reported. Perilous STAR and SBWD are focusing more on fund raising. Or maybe a push for publicity for a L1 club is pointless when the Champions League knock outs are happening and we have an exciting Premier League title race.