We're ManchesteROFL United, we do what we want

[Royal Rother]

As I said a few weeks ago.... (I thought that felt familiar as I posted it...)

Ferguson did brilliantly last year with the self same team (virtually) that Moyes has.

That bunch of players who last year looked like a real team of fighters, capable of really turning it on when it mattered, of playing hard until the 90th minute now look like a bunch of no-hopers.

And it's supposed to be Ferguson's fault?

Priceless. Absolutely bloody priceless.

The players must certainly look at themselves but a top manager could not possibly have failed so miserably to get a tune out of the Championship winning squad.

Moyes is not a top manager. And now the Board know it. There's nothing more to say really.

No way will he be given £200m + to rebuild the team. No way. He's a gonner.

Man Utd need some top new players. It will be very difficult to entice them to OT without Champions League football, and doubly so when the manager has so clearly failed.

With either one of the 2 drawbacks outlined above in place they would have to pay well over the odds in wages to get the players they need to drag them back up the table. Without the £40m + from Champions League football and a probably huge hike in huge wages they could be heading for a big loss next year. And then an injection from the owners to cover it or face a massive fine under Financial Fair Play rules.

With that hanging over them there is, I repeat, no way they can take the gamble of sticking with Moyes.

It's more likely Fergie will be back managing them than Moyes still there next season.

[Franchise FC]

Are people STILL defending Moyes and blaming Ferguson?

Priceless.

If you read what I've written you'll see that the main point concerns the lack of fight. That's entirely down to Moyes - there's no way Fergie would have allowed his teams to roll over the way Utd have done throughout the season.

[TBM]

Wtf has Moyes done to Man Utd? They look clueless.

He hasn't bought, that's the problem. They need 2 more midfielders and a right back at least.

Rubbish. Same team as won the league last year. Only diff is a change of manager.

And the change in back room staff and style of football.

They weren't brilliant champions though. It's the same when City won it, the next season they didn't strengthen and it showed. Fergie knew how to get the best out of average players, Moyes doesn't so they need to shift those players out and bring in quality.

[Royal Rother]

But what real quality will go there with no CL football, and Moyes as manager?

Nobody, unless they were being paid massively OTT wages, and quite simply the club cannot afford to do that unless Glazers put their own money up, or they are happy to face huge fines / tfr embargoes etc. a couple of years down the road. (Or they raise money by selling the naming rights of the stadium, which I suspect is the most likely course of action.)

They are in deep shit street now.

[TBM]

But what real quality will go there with no CL football, and Moyes as manager?

Nobody, unless they were being paid massively OTT wages, and quite simply the club cannot afford to do that unless Glazers put their own money up, or they are happy to face huge fines / tfr embargoes etc. a couple of years down the road. (Or they raise money by selling the naming rights of the stadium, which I suspect is the most likely course of action.)

They are in deep shit street now.

Liverpool still managed to attract decent players without having the CL. Remember this is Man Utd, one of the most known and respected teams in the world

[Royal Rother]

Oh they'll attract decent players, for sure - but real quality, like absolute World Class (and I don't mean Rooneyesque 3rd rate not actually world class at all).... I can't see it myself.

But also, I believe Liverpool made huge losses in the last 2 years which, if repeated in the next year or 2 would result in fines, possible points deductions and tfr embargoes if not covered by capital injection (not loans) from the owners.

[AthleticoSpizz]

Retro Kes gets one point from his three favoured teams this weekend!

Despite your take on Moyes etc RR...Fergie saw that the party was over and got out at exactly the right time.

I'm no scarse lover...but you have to fancy their chances....well done Brendan.

[Royal Rother]

I don't agree. How many times had he rebuilt the team to become Champions after the old one had passed it's sell-by....?

He loved that bit of the job and would have loved to have done it again but felt at 72 he was pretty much done.

Unfortunately Moyes has clearly demonstrated that he isn't good enough to manage at the highest level and certainly isn't good enough to carry out that rebuilding process.

[AthleticoSpizz]

We agree to disagree?

Moyes has Fergie "unofficially" mentoring/guiding him doesn't he?

[Man Friday]

We agree to disagree?

Moyes has Fergie "unofficially" mentoring/guiding him doesn't he?

Maybe. But either way he's not the manager engaging with the players. World of difference.

[Man Friday]

But what real quality will go there with no CL football, and Moyes as manager?

Nobody, unless they were being paid massively OTT wages, and quite simply the club cannot afford to do that unless Glazers put their own money up, or they are happy to face huge fines / tfr embargoes etc. a couple of years down the road. (Or they raise money by selling the naming rights of the stadium, which I suspect is the most likely course of action.)

They are in deep shit street now.

Liverpool still managed to attract decent players without having the CL. Remember this is Man Utd, one of the most known and respected teams in the world

Decent, yes, but with the exception of Suarez not WC. Moyes would have them in the relegation zone.

[TBM]

He didn't with Everton, so not sure why you say this......

[Ian Royal]

Same rubbish team that only won last year as everyone else was sh*t.

Yeah, you're right, Man U won the PL because everyone else was sh1t. Shame my old pub team weren't in the PL last season, we'd have come second.

This would be the team that had to ask Scholes to come out of retirement because its midfield was shit, and rely on another player in his late 30s.

That team had paper over the cracks and got by on sheer force of Fergie's personality and everyone else's inadequacies / fear of him.

Moyes isn't doing a good job, but he was on a hiding to nothing in the first place.

[AthleticoSpizz]

+1 Ian

don't forget....the referees aren't quite so "under the spell" either

[paultheroyal]

Demise of Manchester United = absolutely fantastic!

More of the same please.

[AthleticoSpizz]

just need the classless Chelsea to follow suit...then The MaraudingkesRoyal will be apoplectic

[6ft Kerplunk]

And yet another week goes by without Suarez scoring against one of the top top teams etc etc.

[Man Friday]

Man U aren't a top team at the mo, let alone a 'top top' team.

[Hoop Blah]

He hasn't bought, that's the problem. They need 2 more midfielders and a right back at least.

Rubbish. Same team as won the league last year. Only diff is a change of manager.

And the change in back room staff and style of football.

They weren't brilliant champions though. It's the same when City won it, the next season they didn't strengthen and it showed. Fergie knew how to get the best out of average players, Moyes doesn't so they need to shift those players out and bring in quality.

Not only have the others strengthened, and United weakened (through age and retirements) but most crucially they've just lost their edge. The manager hasn't got the command of the dressing room yet to really get the players fearing for their places and their future in the way they did under Fergie and as a result they've all dropped their performances (Rooney apart I guess) by a few percent.

I'm not sure any manager can really stamp their authority on a dressing room in the way Fergie did (a sign of the times and money involved as much as Fergie's brilliance) but with too many older players not playing for their lives and the younger ones not quite being good enough yet Moyes needs time to build his own side.

It reminds a fair bit of when Fergie announced he was going to retire about 10 years ago. United, who I think had won the league the season before, where awful for the first half of the season. Fergie then changed his mind and the players started playing for him again because they had that fear factor back. The result was they went on an excellent run and qualified for the Champions League again when it had been looking shakey for them.

I think it just goes to show how players need that something extra to perform at the maximum and that Fergie was outstanding at making that happen.

I think Moyes can get them there, but, and it's a massive but, he has to have the backing in the transfer market to build a side that want to play for him and United more than just earn money from any CL side.

[PistolPete]

Utd have 4 players who are better suited to the 'number 10' position - Kagawa, Mata, Janusaj and Rooney.

If you compare their wingers to where they want to be, they're miles off - Bale and Ronaldo, Ribery and Robben. Barca play a different stlyle and have Messi so not a great comparison.

The defence is a shambles and needs big investment.

De Gea is good enough. Carrick and Fellaini could be ok holding, any one of the above could do the number 10 job.

They need a left back, a centre back or two and two new wide men!

Giggs, Evra, Vidic, Ferdidnand, Valencia, Kagawa, Young, Nani, Anderson, Bebe, Buttner and Welbeck have to go...