We're ManchesteROFL United, we do what we want

[Pepe the Horseman]

Utd have 4 players who are better suited to the 'number 10' position - Kagawa, Mata, Janusaj and Rooney.

If you compare their wingers to where they want to be, they're miles off - Bale and Ronaldo, Ribery and Robben. Barca play a different stlyle and have Messi so not a great comparison.

The defence is a shambles and needs big investment.

De Gea is good enough. Carrick and Fellaini could be ok holding, any one of the above could do the number 10 job.

They need a left back, a centre back or two and two new wide men!

Giggs, Evra, Vidic, Ferdidnand, Valencia, Kagawa, Young, Nani, Anderson, Bebe, Buttner and Welbeck have to go...

Ferdidntnand more like

[TBM]

Utd have 4 players who are better suited to the 'number 10' position - Kagawa, Mata, Janusaj and Rooney.

If you compare their wingers to where they want to be, they're miles off - Bale and Ronaldo, Ribery and Robben. Barca play a different stlyle and have Messi so not a great comparison.

The defence is a shambles and needs big investment.

De Gea is good enough. Carrick and Fellaini could be ok holding, any one of the above could do the number 10 job.

They need a left back, a centre back or two and two new wide men!

Giggs, Evra, Vidic, Ferdidnand, Valencia, Kagawa, Young, Nani, Anderson, Bebe, Buttner and Welbeck have to go...

I would say they need a right back too - Rafael is shocking

[Hoop Blah]

I reckon it's a big run in for the likes of Smalling and Jones. They have the potential to play themselves into or out of Moyes plans for next season. It will cost a massive amount to replace the whole back four but it does look like they may need to do it.

An interesting and expensive summer coming up for United. The big issue for them is that they probably haven't got the spending power of the super rich clubs now so they'll possibly struggle to buy the key players they need.

[Schards#2]

All very well to point out the shortcomings of the team Moyes inherited but no one, literally no one, expected the drop off in performances and results to be to this extent and for that Moyes has to be accountable. They are a million miles away from Champions League qualification and it's hard to see why next season would be any different.

[TBM]

I would lol if Utd ended up winning the Champions League this season

[Hoop Blah]

All very well to point out the shortcomings of the team Moyes inherited but no one, literally no one, expected the drop off in performances and results to be to this extent and for that Moyes has to be accountable. They are a million miles away from Champions League qualification and it's hard to see why next season would be any different.

Agreed, but nobody expected them to be so inactive in the transfer market either.

With the squad they've got they should be doing better. No doubt about that. That's why I think it is some similar to when Fergie was going to quit before and they looked like they'd possibly miss out on Champions League qualification again.

The players have switched off a bit. When they did it under Fergie it didn't make him a bad manager or not up to the job. It just meant he'd lost the authority in the dressing room because they all knew he was going.

I'm sure that's similar now as there are a number of players at United that think they'll outlast the manager or are seeing out their time playing at 90%. That attitude surely spreads and it's snowballed from there.

[BR2]

Perhaps we will now hear a bit less about the "wonderful" young players that were called up prematurely by England in Jones, Smalling and Cleverley who, if they had been at Fulham or Stoke would have got nowhere near the England set-up.

Just to remind those that are spouting the line about Fergie needing time when he first got the job so Moyes should get the same:-
Moyes took over the Champions whereas Fergie took over a mid-table side.
Moyes has not lost any players from the Championship-winning side
Moyes has bought (or at least the club has ) two players costing about £65 million

Yesterday was so embarrassig for the Dog and his fellow fans that they chanted non-stop the same song about their title wins and as with the Cantona chant they are living in the past.

[Hoop Blah]

I don't think anyone has said Moyes has lost a load of players, although he did of course lose Scholes and, for a large of slice of the season, Van Persie when he needed him to get them out of trouble like he did for Fergie last season.

The crux is that Moyes isn't getting as much out of these players as Fergie did. That's why Fergie is one of the greatest managers ever and his 20 years of success gave him the power in the dressing room to do get so much out of that squad last year.

Moyes is struggling. I don't think anyone is pretending he isn't, but the discussion is surely about why and can he turn is around rather than he is or isn't.

[paultheroyal]

I would lol if Utd ended up winning the Champions League this season

They wont!

[Maguire]

It's all very well saying "he inherited champions" but it's not like he took over one of United's real pedigree teams. Last season's championship put a gloss on an otherwise average side carried to a large extent by a superb striker who happened to avoid injury for most of the season.

This season, that striker is a shadow of his former self and all their main rivals (Liverpool, Arsenal, City, and Chelsea) are distinctly better than they were last term. It all adds up to failure before you even consider the other issues - new manager, poor transfer activity, wholesale changes to staff, etc.

[Hoop Blah]

BR, just to point out another inaccuracy from your Scouse-fueled rant, Phil Jones was an England player before he joined United.

[YateleyRoyal]

BR, just to point out another inaccuracy from your Scouse-fueled rant, Phil Jones was an England player before he joined United.

No he wasnt.

[TBM]

tbf he was called up in the August that he joined Utd, so hadn't actually played any games for Utd.....so they were going on his Blackburn form

[floyd__streete]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26607980

LOL @ predicting that the biggest club in the country with the highest earning potential "might not win the league for another 10 years".

What is worse, this kind of diabolical punditry we directly pay for through the anachronistic licence fee. Privatise the BBC.

[Royalclapper]

No doubt Moyes was dealt a bad hand, and he's been a bit suspect in organising what he has got but who were the other contenders - Mourinho, Klopp?
Would Utd be better than they are now if either of those had taken over?

He needs to be braver IMO and should have dropped RVP yesterday, a lot of the players look like they'll be playing elsewhere sometime soon and are just going through the motions. Way too much mediocre talent in their squad that needs clearing out, wonder how many managers they will try within the next 5 years or so if they do pull the trigger on Moyes.

[Hoop Blah]

BR, just to point out another inaccuracy from your Scouse-fueled rant, Phil Jones was an England player before he joined United.

No he wasnt.

He was called up to the Senior side before he'd played for United, although double checking the dates, he had actually stayed with the u21s for the summer Euro's when I thought he'd alread made the senior squad.

More to the point, I don't think being at United got Jones his England call up.

[BR2]

We were just talking here about how many points is a top manager worth, or indeed a different manager.
The concensus was a guess at about 10 points possibly.
Man Utd won the league last year by 11 points?
Mourinho is obviously worth a few points and I would suggest Wenger too and Pulis at Palace has shown what can be done.

Back to Moyes, even allowing for a 10 point fall because of Fergie going that would still mean that Man Utd should be in contention with the same squad (Scholes is not a relevance) as last year plus additions of £65 million of new talent.
Also decisions like giving the vastly inexperienced coaching job to Phil Neville looks like another major error of judgement.

My view is that Moyes is a good manager of a side with no stars , as was the case at Everton, but managing big egos such as exist at Man Utd requires a much different skill set which it appears (and many Man Utd fans are now saying) he doesn't have.
At Everton their more successful periods were when he used the Joe Royle "Dogs of War" approach but this lot at Man Utd don't seem to possess similar traits of working hard, giving their all and scrapping.

BTW Guardiola took over a championship-winning side, made one significant midfielder signing and operating in a new country following a terrific previous coach seems to be doing o.k.

[TBM]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26607980

LOL @ predicting that the biggest club in the country with the highest earning potential "might not win the league for another 10 years".

What is worse, this kind of diabolical punditry we directly pay for through the anachronistic licence fee. Privatise the BBC.

tbf Kevin Kilbane disagreed with him (on MOTD3) and said it'll probably more likely be about 3 years

BUT look at Arsenal, 9 years now without a trophy

[TBM]

BTW Guardiola took over a championship-winning side, made one significant midfielder signing and operating in a new country following a terrific previous coach seems to be doing o.k.

Yeah, but that 1 signing was from their biggest rivals in the title race

[BR2]

BTW Guardiola took over a championship-winning side, made one significant midfielder signing and operating in a new country following a terrific previous coach seems to be doing o.k.

Yeah, but that 1 signing was from their biggest rivals in the title race

Er..Mata from Man Utd's big rivals Chelsea?