Points Deduction AGAIN

[Snowflake Royal]

But if it's costing us more than we can afford, then it's not running the club properly.

It's all well and good wanting fantastic facilities, category one academies etc, but if you can't afford it, you don't do it. Basically the first rule of business management.

Not necessarily if it’s properly investing to be more successful in the future

Don’t think academy costs are counted anyway are they? It at least some exemptions for it

Just taken this from the BBC page from back in 2019.

"Money spent on stadiums, training facilities, youth development or community projects is exempt."

Now whether that means just investment to improve your facilities or just the academy/training facilities in general, I don't know, I've always assumed it was an investment to making them better, rather than the upkeep of them.

If it is the latter, it only muddies the water further about, what else are we spending money on to be so far over the FFP limits previously? If all training/academy facilities etc are exempt, how have we lost £138m worth of accumulated losses over three seasons? Transfer fees and wages will make up a big proportion I'm sure, but what is the rest made up of?

Because we were historically pissing money up the wall.

For two seasons straight, only about 2 years ago our wage bill was 200% of income. Excluding everything else that's a two year loss of about £40m on its own.

At the same time we were throwing around multi million transfer fees.

Selling off every asset we owned so we could rent it back from the owner.

[tidus_mi2]

I think it’s pretty piss poor we haven’t had a statement from the club yet. Bowen was supposed to someone who would communicate with fans for the high level stuff. When was the last time he did an interview about what is going on at the club?

Absolutely, they need to get a statement out before Ince addresses the media today because he will inevitably be asked about it if we don't get a statement which isn't right or fair to Ince to have to answer.

[Stranded]

Being discussed on TalkSport now with Mike Keegan of Daily Mail

In brief:

Revenue coming in is fine (inc. MU Cup tie)

Expenditure (wages) is possibly the issue looking at players they have

League are currently reviewing accounts

Knock on for other clubs (i.e. Peterborough who went down last season but abided by the rules could have a case to bring)

Questioning ownership model - what is the source of money coming in? What is the gain for the owner?

What sanctions now? Repeat offenders should be dealt with more harshly

Issue could be Reading being unable to get players off their books but they agreed to business plan

Feel sorry for players and Paul Ince

But I don't get the part about "not being able to get players off our books"? The EFL have signed off all of our incoming transfers which surely means we are in line with what they've said?

If they've signed off some of our signings knowing it was going to go over budget (likewise we knew we were going over the budget) and both parties have just accepted that, then what was the point in agreeing to a Business Plan in the first place?

The not getting players off the books bit just doesn't make sense (doesn't mean its not a problem tho) given the, what, month long wait we had waiting to sign Sarr as we had to wait for Puscas to move out. If we absolutely had to get say Joao off the books then I stuggle to understand how we were allowed to sign any players i.e. AC2 until that was done - if it was part of the plan set out and agreed to by both parties.

Also, if the club did agree to sell certain assets (or make them available) and failed to do so then that is a) stupid and b) really f*cking stupid.

[Stranded]

I think it’s pretty piss poor we haven’t had a statement from the club yet. Bowen was supposed to someone who would communicate with fans for the high level stuff. When was the last time he did an interview about what is going on at the club?

Absolutely, they need to get a statement out before Ince addresses the media today because he will inevitably be asked about it if we don't get a statement which isn't right or fair to Ince to have to answer.

Whilst I agree, all Ince has to say is - "A statement will be realised by the club in due course and I won't be answering any questions on yesterday's reports as a result"

[morganb]

Being discussed on TalkSport now with Mike Keegan of Daily Mail

In brief:

Revenue coming in is fine (inc. MU Cup tie)

Expenditure (wages) is possibly the issue looking at players they have

League are currently reviewing accounts

Knock on for other clubs (i.e. Peterborough who went down last season but abided by the rules could have a case to bring)

Questioning ownership model - what is the source of money coming in? What is the gain for the owner?

What sanctions now? Repeat offenders should be dealt with more harshly

Issue could be Reading being unable to get players off their books but they agreed to business plan

Feel sorry for players and Paul Ince

But I don't get the part about "not being able to get players off our books"? The EFL have signed off all of our incoming transfers which surely means we are in line with what they've said?

If they've signed off some of our signings knowing it was going to go over budget (likewise we knew we were going over the budget) and both parties have just accepted that, then what was the point in agreeing to a Business Plan in the first place?

The not getting players off the books bit just doesn't make sense (doesn't mean its not a problem tho) given the, what, month long wait we had waiting to sign Sarr as we had to wait for Puscas to move out. If we absolutely had to get say Joao off the books then I stuggle to understand how we were allowed to sign any players i.e. AC2 until that was done - if it was part of the plan set out and agreed to by both parties.

Also, if the club did agree to sell certain assets (or make them available) and failed to do so then that is a) stupid and b) really f*cking stupid.

By the tone of the journalist's voice it almost sounded like he was guessing/making it up. Didn't come across as very authoritative on the subject. Kept wittering on about being a Peterborough supporter and how they should feel hard done by. I'm a bit more sceptical about it all now and think us Nobbers know more than the national press on matters relating to Reading.

[tidus_mi2]

But I don't get the part about "not being able to get players off our books"? The EFL have signed off all of our incoming transfers which surely means we are in line with what they've said?

If they've signed off some of our signings knowing it was going to go over budget (likewise we knew we were going over the budget) and both parties have just accepted that, then what was the point in agreeing to a Business Plan in the first place?

The not getting players off the books bit just doesn't make sense (doesn't mean its not a problem tho) given the, what, month long wait we had waiting to sign Sarr as we had to wait for Puscas to move out. If we absolutely had to get say Joao off the books then I stuggle to understand how we were allowed to sign any players i.e. AC2 until that was done - if it was part of the plan set out and agreed to by both parties.

Also, if the club did agree to sell certain assets (or make them available) and failed to do so then that is a) stupid and b) really f*cking stupid.

By the tone of the journalist's voice it almost sounded like he was guessing/making it up. Didn't come across as very authoritative on the subject. Kept wittering on about being a Peterborough supporter and how they should feel hard done by. I'm a bit more sceptical about it all now and think us Nobbers know more than the national press on matters relating to Reading.

When I was responding to a fan of another club who replied to the article basically saying they should throw the book at us, I called the article "gutter journalism", I personally don't have high regard for the Telegraph, found out shortly after that John Percy blocked me.

Now maybe I'm reading too much into that reaction, but I feel if you've got concrete evidence in this docked points rumour, I just feel you wouldn't block someone for that, in fact you might be a bit smug when it actually happens.

[Elm Park Kid]

"The club is aware of recent media speculation regarding the EFL and our requirements under P&S rules. We would like to draw attention to the official EFL statement that this process is continuing as per our arrangement and that no other information has been communicated to us.

Everyone at the club is committed to Reading Football Club being successful both on and off the pitch. We welcome all future constructive cooperation with the EFL on this matter."

There you go - I've made one up for you. Does that make you happy?

[tidus_mi2]

Club have made a statement now. Seems to give the impression to me that the media stories are exaggerating the current situation.

[RG30]

In November 2021, the EFL and Reading Football Club reached an Agreed Decision in respect of the club’s failure to comply with the League’s Profit and Sustainability Rules over the course of a four-year period prior to the punishment of a six point deduction applied last season.

As part of the decision, the club is required to comply with the terms of a business plan up until the end of season 2022-23.

The plan focuses on a number of financial targets with the objective of improving the club’s financial performance and, working in close collaboration with the EFL throughout, we are confident that significant progress has been made in aiming to achieve those financial targets – specifically in addressing the budget for the football side of the business.

A phenomenal amount of hard work has been put in behind the scenes in recent years – work which has seen us make radical changes, on and off the pitch, and take huge strides in rectifying a difficult historical situation. Our problems of the past are not all easy quick fixes of course, but that hard work will continue as we collectively strive to take this club forward.

The Club Financial Reporting Unit within the EFL is currently reviewing our submissions to determine whether compliance with the plan has been achieved and we remain in regular consultation with the League. We would like to thank our fans for their loyalty, understanding and continued patience during this process and we will communicate with our supporters when it is next appropriate to issue any further comment on this matter.

https://readingfc.co.uk//news/2023/marc ... efl-review

[Kitsondinho]

Club have made a statement now. Seems to give the impression to me that the media stories are exaggerating the current situation.

Well isn’t that surprising.

Club seem fairly convinced we’ll be ok.

[Hound]

Fair enough

Highlighting the collaboration with the EFL. It’s a joint failure if we’ve failed to meet the ‘business plan’ if they have indeed been as involved with all our dealings as suggested

[Wycombe Royal]

Club have made a statement now. Seems to give the impression to me that the media stories are exaggerating the current situation.

Well isn’t that surprising.

Club seem fairly convinced we’ll be ok.

I didn't read it like that. It was more about we have made progress but leaves it open to the view that we may not have done enough.

[RG30]

Exactly how I interpreted it. We’re getting closer but probably won’t be enough.

[Kitsondinho]

Club have made a statement now. Seems to give the impression to me that the media stories are exaggerating the current situation.

Well isn’t that surprising.

Club seem fairly convinced we’ll be ok.

I didn't read it like that. It was more about we have made progress but leaves it open to the view that we may not have done enough.

But that is the thing, all of yesterday’s noise was how people ‘read’ the reports. No decision has been made yet. Nothing in that statement to suggest we’ve aggressively broken the rules. If we have breached, it is clearly a close run thing.

[andrew1957]

In November 2021, the EFL and Reading Football Club reached an Agreed Decision in respect of the club’s failure to comply with the League’s Profit and Sustainability Rules over the course of a four-year period prior to the punishment of a six point deduction applied last season.

As part of the decision, the club is required to comply with the terms of a business plan up until the end of season 2022-23.

The plan focuses on a number of financial targets with the objective of improving the club’s financial performance and, working in close collaboration with the EFL throughout, we are confident that significant progress has been made in aiming to achieve those financial targets – specifically in addressing the budget for the football side of the business.

A phenomenal amount of hard work has been put in behind the scenes in recent years – work which has seen us make radical changes, on and off the pitch, and take huge strides in rectifying a difficult historical situation. Our problems of the past are not all easy quick fixes of course, but that hard work will continue as we collectively strive to take this club forward.

The Club Financial Reporting Unit within the EFL is currently reviewing our submissions to determine whether compliance with the plan has been achieved and we remain in regular consultation with the League. We would like to thank our fans for their loyalty, understanding and continued patience during this process and we will communicate with our supporters when it is next appropriate to issue any further comment on this matter.

https://readingfc.co.uk//news/2023/marc ... efl-review

Good statement. Nothing more they can realistically say. I think we will just have to be patient and see how this works out. I think any points deduction is likely to apply next season - as we would most likely survive anyway this time. If so the EFL will most likely be relegating us, as we will lose a lot of players in the summer and barring some Bowen miracle working, we will very likely have a much poorer squad next time - if we remain under embargo for another season.

If we do receive further punishment I would feel a tad sorry for the club now, as they do seem to be doing all they can now to rectify the mistakes of the past.

[Brum Royal]

we are confident that significant progress has been made in aiming to achieve those financial targets

This line is just a bit too heavy on the wooliness for my liking

[Hound]

Re-read a few times and to me sounds like they think they’ve either close to doing enough or done enough

It’s definitely a bit non committal on whether they think they’ve achieved that though.

Very much highlighting how much they have done so far and how much they’ve worked with the EFL

[Stranded]

Re-read a few times and to me sounds like they think they’ve either close to doing enough or done enough

It’s definitely a bit non committal on whether they think they’ve achieved that though.

Very much highlighting how much they have done so far and how much they’ve worked with the EFL

You can tell that every word has been drafted by a solicitor or team of them to be very careful to be clear that the club have worked their arse off, are doing everything they can and most importantly have been working closely with the EFL to ensure the plan is met.

What it also doesn't and rightly shouldn't do is be categorical that we haven't breached as that is not the clubs decision and would likely make matters worse if we do.

Good statement in the circumstances and the tone also seems a bit peeved that they have had to talk about this now.

[Za Vas]

we are confident that significant progress has been made in aiming to achieve those financial targets

This line is just a bit too heavy on the wooliness for my liking

Agreed - this screams "we've done our best but not hit our targets" to me.

[Mr Angry]

Having read both the EFL and Reading FC statements a couple of times, it seems to me that the EFL are carrying out their planned, routine assessment of what we have done, and we are confident that we have done a lot - "significant progress" - to achieving ALL financial the targets.

However, there is a possibility that we may be in some sort of breach - we won't know until the EFL have concluded their assessment and reported.

What that suggests to me is that someone (probably from the EFL) has given an off the record breifing to a journo that they are assessing our progress and there is a possibility of a breach; said journo then spins that to suggest we may get docked the 6 points suspended from last season, at which point other journo's pile in and the "may get docked" becomes "are going to get docked" and then, as with all good consipracy theories, the original "sexed up" article becomes the base for all the reports that follow (which are written to make it appear it is fact, when in fact it is merely speculation).

Nothing in either statement suggests:

1. that any final assessment has been made.
2. that we are in breach of any of the financial requirements we were put under.
3. that we are in any way "discussing our punishment".

It may come to pass that we ARE in breach, but right now there is no way any journo can be 100% certain of that.

Unless both the EFL and Reading FC have put out deliberately misleading statements today........