QPR points deduction?

[Svlad Cjelli]

Has anyone answered my query as to who QPR appeal to, if they appeal? Surely it's the same panel who make the judgement in the first place - so why would they change their minds?

A different panel within the FA, composed of different people within the FA.

[Seal]

What will happen over three days of evidence-giving, cross-examining and justice-weighing is almost anybody's guess and anybody who tells you otherwise doesn't really understand what is going on

Quite.

As I said on 7th April :

It's certainly not "clearly a situation where the rules have been broken" - that's the whole point in this and that's what makes it so open interpretation and subject to legal argument - and why they've scheduled 3 days for the hearing.

The rules on third-party ownership are torturous, extremely complicated and very much open to interpretation. As I understand it, QPR's case is that they believe that the player wasn't owned by a 3rd party in that they had done everything they needed to ensure they had control of the player, even though a third-party had financial interest in that player's contract. The FA believe the opposite, in that the third-party had a controlling interest in the player rather than QPR. But it's not a simple contract which is owned by one person or another - it's a contract which is wholly or partly owner by external, overseas, investors.

So this will be lots of legal argument about financial interests and so on - rendered horrible complicated and open to interpretation and argument by lawyers (and QPR will have paid for the best lawyers to represent them, of course!) so it's anything but a cut and dried

So what chances a decision being made by Friday?

Biggest mistake in all this is that it's taken so long to get to the hearing, and now they have a mere 3 days to get it done before the end of the regular season.

[Svlad Cjelli]

Good chances - they have 3 solid days dedicated to it.

BTW, it has been suggested that the reasons for the delays are the needs to get documents and witness statements from people in Agentina, and get them all translated etc.

[brendywendy]

even with QPRs laywers doing everything they can scheme up to delay, and confuse the issues?

[Royal Lady]

Has anyone answered my query as to who QPR appeal to, if they appeal? Surely it's the same panel who make the judgement in the first place - so why would they change their minds?

A different panel within the FA, composed of different people within the FA.

But surely, the FA are all singing from the same hymn sheet? Which is why I reckon the original penalty will be a massive fine and relegation to League One - and on appeal they will reduce it to remaining in the Championship.

Norwich get promoted as Champions on Saturday, whoever finishes 3rd gets 2nd auto place and 4-7th go into the play offs.

[Svlad Cjelli]

A fairly technical appraisal of the situation from a lawyer : http://www.thomaseggar.com/ebulletins/the-sport-lawyer--qprs-third-party-ownership-hearing-starts

A fairly non-technical appriasal of the situation (featuring - ahem - a lot of words you've seen already!) and also comments from supporters of affected clubs : http://theseventytwo.com/football-league/championship/2011/05/04/qpr-alejandro-faurlin-and-the-great-unknown/

[Z175]

bubibe, that's been said many times on this discussion but my feeling is that QPR will be the weakest team in the play-offs as they'll be at a low psychological point having won the league in their minds fairly, then having to go out and win promotion all over again.

Warnock's powers of mitivation are obviousy superb but it would be a hell of a blow to the players and I don't think they'd be able to pick themselves up to take on the play offs with full undimmed focus.

I think QPRs form is not great at the moment, but the huge sense of injustice and motivation they will have will surely blow everyonr away. The referees will be very aware that "if they make a decision in another teams favour that turned out to be incorrect then they will be causing the FA a huge headache" (I.e. QPR will get every decision.)

If its 15 points, they will probably play us, and as above we won't have Legs. Therefore I now want them automatically promoted, although obviously League 1 would be my preference!

Also I think Cardiffs pressure is too much and they have history of blowing it. Swansea are a nice side but not great and exceedingly beatable by a cynically direct championship side playing box to box midfielders. Forest have a terrible defence...In fact I would bet on Swans/Forest or Reading coming 20th in the premierleague if they make it.

But we can do it if we don't play QPR!

[Man Friday]

But I guess they knew that when they set the date of the hearing.

They set the hearing date as soon as they could having at last some conclusions from the investigation. The problem lies in the fact that the investigation has been ongoing since September.

[Man Friday]

If the PL wasn't a separate body from the FL then they could institute the points deduction from NEXT season. This would be fairest/best all round. This is often what happens with Administration cases.

[Svlad Cjelli]

If the PL wasn't a separate body from the FL then they could institute the points deduction from NEXT season. This would be fairest/best all round. This is often what happens with Administration cases.

There's no reason why the FA can't institute a points deduction from NEXT season.

[Man Friday]

Then that's what should happen. And I think will.

[TFF]

So they should be rewarded for their (alleged) rule breaking with promotion and four years' parachute payments?

That's quite a disincentive to any other clubs wanting to take a tilt at the big time.

[Royal Lady]

So they should be rewarded for their (alleged) rule breaking with promotion and four years' parachute payments?

That's quite a disincentive to any other clubs wanting to take a tilt at the big time.

On the contrary - it gives the clear the message - do what you want - cos you won't be fined/deducted points until the following season and if you hit lucky - you're quids in anyway. Which is why I think they'll relegate them or at least stop them from going into the Prem and benefitting from their cheating.

[Man Friday]

So they should be rewarded for their (alleged) rule breaking with promotion and four years' parachute payments?

That's quite a disincentive to any other clubs wanting to take a tilt at the big time.

I understand your sentiments but it's simply too late to act this season. The punishment needs to be futuristic. Clearly there needs to be an adjustment over parachute payments.

[The Rouge]

When are we expecting to hear?

[Cobi]

When are we expecting to hear?

Friday.

[Muskrat]

So they should be rewarded for their (alleged) rule breaking with promotion and four years' parachute payments?

That's quite a disincentive to any other clubs wanting to take a tilt at the big time.

The punishment needs to be futuristic.

Maybe they'll ban their players from wearing the new fangled jet boots?

[Royal Lady]

So they should be rewarded for their (alleged) rule breaking with promotion and four years' parachute payments?

That's quite a disincentive to any other clubs wanting to take a tilt at the big time.

I understand your sentiments but it's simply too late to act this season. The punishment needs to be futuristic. Clearly there needs to be an adjustment over parachute payments.

Why is it? We all know QPR will appeal if found guilty - so they set their decision a lot higher than they intend, so that when it goes to appeal - the appeals panel (apparently comprising of a different set of FA people) will just reduce it down slightly - hence, I still stand by a multi-million pound fine and relegation to League One. On appeal, they will be re-instated to Championship for next season and the fine will be halved - everyone (except QPR) will be happy!

[Tinrib]

So they should be rewarded for their (alleged) rule breaking with promotion and four years' parachute payments?

That's quite a disincentive to any other clubs wanting to take a tilt at the big time.

I understand your sentiments but it's simply too late to act this season. The punishment needs to be futuristic. Clearly there needs to be an adjustment over parachute payments.

To the contary - I think the FA have played this spot on (so far) ..

Having the hearing this late in the season has ensured that this Championship season has been played to its potential and with no question marks over the integrity of all the teams playing through the season (On the pitch) . This way, the season has been a level playing field. Every team has performed to its maximum.

If the FA chose to do this half way through the season, and fined/ docked points on QPR - that may have been season defining - then you have a situation where QPR may have given up the ghost and performances may have droppped and the table may well have ended up looking a whole lot different.

My gut feel is there will be a points deduction. Maybe as high as 30.

[Royal Bison]

My instinct tells me there will be a very large fine, but no points deduction.

I wait to be proved wrong