BFTG Villa

[Hound]

the better comparison imo is the Mings/Zlatan one.

To me, they look very similar. Not 100% obvious but enough in it to suggest he could have at the very least done more to get out of the way. In fact, I think the one or sat was worse.

I'm not too sure how they could charge him for Zlatan but not for Oliveira

[Maneki Neko]

not saying they wont charge him.

imo I think its a bit off to assume that either offence was deliberate/intentional or that he could have done anything else with his foot when off balance/tangled up with oliviera, based on a split second reaction reviewed in tv footage.
football is dangerous physical game and occasionally people come together and one of them ends up in hospital through no fault of anyone.

imo.

[Old Man Andrews]

The FA are reviewing it.

[Hound]

yeah just looked at Brum Mail which said they are looking at it today

Comically they have an article on Reading fans reaction the Villa game, with all the quotes taken from this thread

[Old Man Andrews]

yeah just looked at Brum Mail which said they are looking at it today

Comically they have an article on Reading fans reaction the Villa game, with all the quotes taken from this thread

Can't find this. Link?

[Snowball]

Just for the record, I always thought Hunt deliberately kneed Czech

[Hound]

yeah just looked at Brum Mail which said they are looking at it today

Comically they have an article on Reading fans reaction the Villa game, with all the quotes taken from this thread

Can't find this. Link?

seems to have fallen off the page. but a quick google found it here:

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/ ... s-15775443

[Nameless]

cannot see how you can judge it without knowing his intent, which is impossible.
it looks iffy, and youd think he could have tried to avoid it more, but that's all a bit vague to be charging someone for
imo

If you believe a former ref his intent doesn't come into it.

https://mobile.twitter.com/RefereeHalse ... 3622682624

in which case its even harderto prove anything.
there was a coming together, he got a bit tangled up and fell over oliveira, and in a split second his foot came down on his face.
for me any charge would only be down to the seriousness of the injury rather than any certainty about mings doing him on purpose, which seems a bit off. for me.
hunt didn't mean to do it, but in real time and slow mo to anyone who isnt a one eyed reading supporter) it looked like he probably dropped his knee into Czechs head on purpose.

What is it about the Oliviera incident that makes it different to the Ibrahimovic incident ? He was not only found guilty of the Ibrahimovic one but given 2 extra game ban because of the seriousness of the incident.
The key is not did he got out to assault Oliviera but did he take all reasonable care not to do something that would cause injury. Personally I think he may have just left his leg in with the intention of giving Oliviera a bit of a tap and got it badly wrong. Players do that sort of thing all the time, winding up your opposite number is part of the game but when it goes wrong you have to take responsibility.

[Nameless]

The FA are reviewing it.

Ah, the ref didn’t see it (I assume)

[NewCorkSeth]

yeah just looked at Brum Mail which said they are looking at it today

Comically they have an article on Reading fans reaction the Villa game, with all the quotes taken from this thread

Can't find this. Link?

seems to have fallen off the page. but a quick google found it here:

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/ ... s-15775443

That's hilarious.

[Bigtimmeh]

Agreed, it didn't look too bad in real time, but the footage and injury is conclusive in my opinion. Everyone is comparing this to hunt cech but that is different as they were travelling towards each other (not in the same direction) and the goalie dives at the ball and so has head in danger zone... rather than being tripped and stamped on when running together as mings did..

[Nameless]

I was ever asked for permission to use my comment. Surely that is an infringement of my intellectual property rights....

[Old Man Andrews]

I was ever asked for permission to use my comment. Surely that is an infringement of my intellectual property rights....

Not when you post it on a public forum no. If they have changed what you orginally wrote then you'd have a case though.

[Bigtimmeh]

I was ever asked for permission to use my comment. Surely that is an infringement of my intellectual property rights....

Nope...if memory serves there's an exemption for news reporting...

[10539.4 Miles Away]

cannot see how you can judge it without knowing his intent, which is impossible.
it looks iffy, and youd think he could have tried to avoid it more, but that's all a bit vague to be charging someone for
imo

If you believe a former ref his intent doesn't come into it.

https://mobile.twitter.com/RefereeHalse ... 3622682624

in which case its even harderto prove anything.
there was a coming together, he got a bit tangled up and fell over oliveira, and in a split second his foot came down on his face.
for me any charge would only be down to the seriousness of the injury rather than any certainty about mings doing him on purpose, which seems a bit off. for me.
hunt didn't mean to do it, but in real time and slow mo to anyone who isnt a one eyed reading supporter) it looked like he probably dropped his knee into Czechs head on purpose.

I actually think it makes it pretty straight forward to ban Mings if intent isn't required. All l he had to do was take evasive action to avoid the 'stamp.' In real time and slow mo its pretty clear (in my own opinion trying desperately not to be blinkered) that there were numerous ways he could have taken evasive action once the motion had started, especially as he looks down at Oliviera's face just before impact.

And regardless of 'Mings called the physio over first' he did it after running for another 3 or 4 steps and calling for a pass. If it was accidental he would surely have stopped immediately.

Either way, hope Nelson is OK and will watch with interest to see if the FA persue it.

[Old Man Andrews]

If you believe a former ref his intent doesn't come into it.

https://mobile.twitter.com/RefereeHalse ... 3622682624

in which case its even harderto prove anything.
there was a coming together, he got a bit tangled up and fell over oliveira, and in a split second his foot came down on his face.
for me any charge would only be down to the seriousness of the injury rather than any certainty about mings doing him on purpose, which seems a bit off. for me.
hunt didn't mean to do it, but in real time and slow mo to anyone who isnt a one eyed reading supporter) it looked like he probably dropped his knee into Czechs head on purpose.

And regardless of 'Mings called the physio over first' he did it after running for another 3 or 4 steps and calling for a pass. If it was accidental he would surely have stopped immediately.

You can look at it the other way though and say that was because Mings didn't know he had stepped on Oliveira's face. Not saying that is the case at all just offering balance. It is the sort of thing he will use if the FA charge him, I don't think there is anyway Mings wouldn't fight the charge.

[10539.4 Miles Away]

in which case its even harderto prove anything.
there was a coming together, he got a bit tangled up and fell over oliveira, and in a split second his foot came down on his face.
for me any charge would only be down to the seriousness of the injury rather than any certainty about mings doing him on purpose, which seems a bit off. for me.
hunt didn't mean to do it, but in real time and slow mo to anyone who isnt a one eyed reading supporter) it looked like he probably dropped his knee into Czechs head on purpose.

And regardless of 'Mings called the physio over first' he did it after running for another 3 or 4 steps and calling for a pass. If it was accidental he would surely have stopped immediately.

You can look at it the other way though and say that was because Mings didn't know he had stepped on Oliveira's face. Not saying that is the case at all just offering balance. It is the sort of thing he will use if the FA charge him, I don't think there is anyway Mings wouldn't fight the charge.

100%. I did think of that angle as well. Just can't believe you wouldn't notice the crunchy wobbliness under your weight bearing leg. Not that I have any personal experience of it apart from squashing the odd cockroach

[10539.4 Miles Away]

Exactly.

Most likely scenario is that Oliveira had just been booked for diving and they were having a bit of a tussle. Mings thought he'd leave a bit on him to try and get a reaction and maybe Oliveira would get a second yellow for retaliating.

I'm sure he didn't mean to do so much damage and once he saw the severity of what he'd done reality kicked in and he felt remorse.

Absolutely 100% this. Oliviera also got right up in Mings face and chased him across the box in the first half when Mings fouled him on the edge of the box first half.

[Snowflake Royal]

cannot see how you can judge it without knowing his intent, which is impossible.
it looks iffy, and youd think he could have tried to avoid it more, but that's all a bit vague to be charging someone for
imo

If you believe a former ref his intent doesn't come into it.

https://mobile.twitter.com/RefereeHalse ... 3622682624

in which case its even harderto prove anything.
there was a coming together, he got a bit tangled up and fell over oliveira, and in a split second his foot came down on his face.
for me any charge would only be down to the seriousness of the injury rather than any certainty about mings doing him on purpose, which seems a bit off. for me.
hunt didn't mean to do it, but in real time and slow mo to anyone who isnt a one eyed reading supporter) it looked like he probably dropped his knee into Czechs head on purpose.

There are three questions here:

Was it violent conduct - kinda implied intent in that, if not explicit, but very hard to say it is violent conduct IMO, it's not a clear punch /kick/headbutt/push etc
Is it excessive force - not really, he's just running, you'll never convincingly show extra force on that
Is it reckless - this is the more likely to stand up of the three IMO. If I was the FA and didn't like what I saw enough to want to charge him (esp with the previous) this is what I'd go with, but I still think a decent advocate could easily challenge at appeal.

[Nameless]

If you believe a former ref his intent doesn't come into it.

https://mobile.twitter.com/RefereeHalse ... 3622682624

in which case its even harderto prove anything.
there was a coming together, he got a bit tangled up and fell over oliveira, and in a split second his foot came down on his face.
for me any charge would only be down to the seriousness of the injury rather than any certainty about mings doing him on purpose, which seems a bit off. for me.
hunt didn't mean to do it, but in real time and slow mo to anyone who isnt a one eyed reading supporter) it looked like he probably dropped his knee into Czechs head on purpose.

There are three questions here:

Was it violent conduct - kinda implied intent in that, if not explicit, but very hard to say it is violent conduct IMO, it's not a clear punch /kick/headbutt/push etc
Is it excessive force - not really, he's just running, you'll never convincingly show extra force on that
Is it reckless - this is the more likely to stand up of the three IMO. If I was the FA and didn't like what I saw enough to want to charge him (esp with the previous) this is what I'd go with, but I still think a decent advocate could easily challenge at appeal.

Those are questions applying to different situations though. We aren’t looking to see if he deserves a caution.
Try looking at the Ibrahimovic incident using those questions and then explain how they decided what happened was way, way worse than ‘an obvious punch’
The issue will be whether Mings could or should have avoided stepping fairly heavily on Oliviera’s face.