FAO Hobnob

[ZacNaloen]

I have a suggestion for cutting costs.


It has something to do with member cards being something Only geeks care about.

[The Rouge]

I had actually assumed that it was more democratic than it was. I would like my views represented, and the views of the thousands currently unrepresented (my view) at present, but I don't have the option of running for board.

Indeed, I assume most people don't. But STAR needs a broader mix of board members from somewhere, and that can only really come from increasing/widening the membership. And that needs people to join.

Rather than simply needing a broader mix of board members, I see it differently. The trouble is these kind of organisations is that if they have the approach of having a few elected board members doing all the work/making all the decisions then you just, generally, get a certain type of person on the board and you get a very hard-to-change and undemocratic organisation.

- hands up who is willing to donate all this time
- oh just you guys huh?
- ok you are board members, what you say goes

Sure for the coach travel they will have this, because those who travel on it should organise it. But they should see themselves as much more than this and potentially look to follow a more-people-donate-less-time model. Regardless, they should seek to understand the views of their members and potential members.

[Alexander Litvinenko]

I have a suggestion for cutting costs.


It has something to do with member cards being something Only geeks care about.

Which only works until you try to have a members-only event like a Fans Forum. That's actually a minimal expense - send people two letters a year and you've blown the £1 membership fee, quite apart from the time spent updating databases and all the other aspects of membership administration.

[The Rouge]

I don't think £10 is too much to ask for. But I also think understanding and representing your views isn't too much to ask for either.

[Alexander Litvinenko]

I don't think £10 is too much to ask for. But I also think understanding and representing your views isn't too much to ask for either.

Then we agree. But why do you expect one to happen without the other?

[The Rouge]

I don't.

[Alexander Litvinenko]

So how come you won't join because they're unrepresentative? Do they need to start representing you before you'll join? And if that's the case, why would you then need to cough up a tenner?

[adief]

STAR - complete and utter waste of time other than for those who enjoy the false feeling of being closer to the club than any of us ever will/can be. Useful only for arranging away game coaches. Does anyone seriously think that the club takes a blind bit of notice of what STAR has to say - read the minutes of meetings with the club for the answer to that question......anodyne/inconsequential/shallow - take your pick. The fans' experience at games is regulated to death so the only issues that have even a faint chance of a hearing are the price of beer and pies and that is hardly a subject for a full blown meeting with minutes and all.

FFS we all go to have a few beers and a dodgy burger before the game, slam the ref and whoever isn't flavour of the month, give the finger to the opposition fans when we score and enjoy the good times and bad in equal measure cos it's what we do on a Saturday. It's just football......nothing more!

[Green]

LAD

Oh, and welcome to the board

[Alexander Litvinenko]

STAR - complete and utter waste of time other than for those who enjoy the false feeling of being closer to the club than any of us ever will/can be. Useful only for arranging away game coaches. Does anyone seriously think that the club takes a blind bit of notice of what STAR has to say - read the minutes of meetings with the club for the answer to that question......anodyne/inconsequential/shallow - take your pick. The fans' experience at games is regulated to death so the only issues that have even a faint chance of a hearing are the price of beer and pies and that is hardly a subject for a full blown meeting with minutes and all.

FFS we all go to have a few beers and a dodgy burger before the game, slam the ref and whoever isn't flavour of the month, give the finger to the opposition fans when we score and enjoy the good times and bad in equal measure cos it's what we do on a Saturday. It's just football......nothing more!

That's a perfectly valid opinion, no problems with that. But you're not moaning about how little they do for you.

[adief]

Not moaning 'cos I don't want or expect them to do anything for me. This thread is in serious danger of disappearing up it's own backside.......it's football stupid!

[The Rouge]

So how come you won't join because they're unrepresentative? Do they need to start representing you before you'll join? And if that's the case, why would you then need to cough up a tenner?

There needs to be a faint promise of representation yes. I am scared otherwise membership will seem like:
- endorsement of current activity
- completely pointless

[Alexander Litvinenko]

So how come you won't join because they're unrepresentative? Do they need to start representing you before you'll join? And if that's the case, why would you then need to cough up a tenner?

There needs to be a faint promise of representation yes. I am scared otherwise membership will seem like:
- endorsement of current activity
- completely pointless

Very defeatist attitude IMHO.

Join and do nothing then it might be like that ... that's down to you, but at least then you'll have the right to protest and be listened to.

[The Rouge]

So how come you won't join because they're unrepresentative? Do they need to start representing you before you'll join? And if that's the case, why would you then need to cough up a tenner?

There needs to be a faint promise of representation yes. I am scared otherwise membership will seem like:
- endorsement of current activity
- completely pointless

Very defeatist attitude IMHO.

Join and do nothing then it might be like that ... that's down to you, but at least then you'll have the right to protest and be listened to.

I disagree that it is defeatist, it is realist. I am happy to go to the cinema even if they are not showing my desired film, but I do want to know they are showing a film.

Having said that I may join - IF I join, what will I physically see/get a chance to vote on? A newsletter and a board member to vote on presumably and that's it? Or do they regularly poll members views on things?

[Ian Royal]

About the numbers Dirk, arent you assuming all star members are as active as hobnobs top members? We've already heard stories of members signing up paying their fee and hearing nothing from star. I really would not be shocked to find that this rings true form a large number of the membership.

I've been a member of STAR and was in no way active. I'd be very surprised if more than 25% of STAR's membership was active in voting and getting involved in what it does. TBH I doubt it's 10%.

Dirk can argue all he likes about joining and changing from within, but without support from others, no one person can join and have any impact and people aren't going to join on their tod, or in ones and twos to affect change if they've got no idea whether others will also follow. They aren't going to want to waste their time chipping away solo getting nowhere and being part of an organisation they dislike, that doesn't support their views. They'd probably have to gather support from a group of at least 10 or 20 people who are either inactive STAR members or would be new joiners. And they're at a massive disadvantage to try and do that compared to the clique at STAR who are already there.

[Royal Lady]

Have to say, I agree with Ian. Say me and Rouge paid our tenners and joined - then what? One or both of us put our names forward to be co-opted onto the board? Who's going to vote for us? There will be people within STAR who know who we are from what we say on here etc - are you seriously suggesting they won't mention this fact to some of their mates in STAR? I may be doing them a great dis-service, but if I was a member of a group and we'd been doing things the same old way for years and no-one within that group ever challenged it - I'd be mighty suspicious of some new person coming in and potentially wanting to change things - so I wouldn't vote them onto the board and, even if they got onto the board, I wouldn't agree with what they want to change, because it's "worked ok so far". If someone could categorically tell me that this wouldn't happen - I'd join STAR. No question.

[Ian Royal]

Good point, even if by some miracle someone does get a group together that joins STAR with enough voting power to get someone onto the board, either to replace one person or a new post... how many are on the board? It's still only one voice amongst half a dozen decision makers.

[winchester_royal]

I am sure a lot on here will not sympathise but it is the posts such as many on this thread that is the reason the rest of the STAR Board are not willing to post on here. There are not enough masochists on the Board to take on the constant abuse and negativity here.

There will be efforts to communicate elsewhere in the RFC universe but not here.

Have you ever considered the possibility that the negativity on this forum is not just typical HNA overreaction, but is in fact accurately representative of the fanbase majority opinion?

[adief]

Have to say, I agree with Ian. Say me and Rouge paid our tenners and joined - then what? One or both of us put our names forward to be co-opted onto the board? Who's going to vote for us? There will be people within STAR who know who we are from what we say on here etc - are you seriously suggesting they won't mention this fact to some of their mates in STAR? I may be doing them a great dis-service, but if I was a member of a group and we'd been doing things the same old way for years and no-one within that group ever challenged it - I'd be mighty suspicious of some new person coming in and potentially wanting to change things - so I wouldn't vote them onto the board and, even if they got onto the board, I wouldn't agree with what they want to change, because it's "worked ok so far". If someone could categorically tell me that this wouldn't happen - I'd join STAR. No question.

Get a grip - it's a tinpot organisation that has absolutely zero influence on club matters and never will regardless of what you would like to think if it was run by the likes of yourself......what exactly has it done to change anything over the years and why would you make a difference?

[Alexander Litvinenko]

Good point, even if by some miracle someone does get a group together that joins STAR with enough voting power to get someone onto the board, either to replace one person or a new post... how many are on the board? It's still only one voice amongst half a dozen decision makers.

You're making the assumption that STAR has lots of people wanting to stand as Board members and so it'd be a struggle to get people elected to the Board. In fact, throughout STAR's 10-year gistory, everyone nominated has been elected, because there has never been more nominees than vacancies.

So if there were three or four people happy to do their bit as Board members, I'm fairly sure that they'd be elected because of the lack of other nominees. Even if they weren't, this would trigger an election, at which point *every* nominee would get a chance to state what they stood for and believed in, and this would be voted for by the whole membership - that can only be good, and it would force everyone, new and old, to make clear what they were all about and believed in.

That can only be good for any organisation, and I'm confident that if people had ideas and opinions and put them to the electorate they'd stand a good chance of being elected. That way change comes ....

And the popular image of the "STAR Clique" that is so beloved on here is way off the mark. A clique is a small group one where no-one else is allowed to join in and participate - the board of STAR is a small group which is like that *because* no-one else wants to join in and participate. Extra people coming forward with ideas and effort would make things so much better for everyone there.