Up to date Selles poll - in or out?

[Sanguine]

Bindon 0 (0)
Guinness-Walker 28 (19)
Abbey 3 (0)
Azeez 34 (12)
Craig 2 (0)
Ehibhatiomhan 8 (2)

I return to our squad. Those six players above who all started at Charlton, league appearances and (starts) at the beginning of the season. Three of them had never started a league game, ever. The other three, just 33 league starts between them. And you could find fewer starts than that on our entire bench at the weekend.

We've added some useful experience in midfield in Lewis Wing, but you can't carry a comfortable mid-table season on the back of Wing, Harvey Knibbs' experience with Cambridge, and Sam Smith. This squad would be struggling in League Two.

[Sanguine]

Get rid now before more damage is done. We can't afford to drop another league.

It's out of any manager's control. Our squad is thin and inexperienced.

I keep hearing this "inexperienced" bit.
I don't subscribe to that. How are these players "inexperienced?
We have seen what Abbey, Bindon, Vickers etc can do. Players are bought up for these moments. Do you think Savage is "inexperienced" or any other loanee/signed player from one of the big boys.
Several teams in this league are in the same boat, no money, run on a shoestring as well.
It's why Colin is the most successful EFL manager ever. Like him or loath him he puts his arm round the players and treats them like he owns them, like a father figure. It's unreal that he got Rotherham and Huddersfield out of spiralling failure.
I'm not saying we should take him, but ask yourself this. If Colin or Wilder or another experienced manager were here, would we be so far down the table.and in a death spiral to league 2. I think we wouldn't be this bad.
Selles is sucking every inch of confidence out of this side with his stubbornness.

I didn't think that you would. They are inexperienced because they have barely played any league football. They don't lack skill, they lack game knowhow. This is evident in the types of goals we concede, and often when we concede them.

[Elm Park Kid]

I have to ask this question - does anyone here actually believe, honestly and truthfully, that they would do a better job at managing that club than Selles? I mean, don't get me wrong, it's fun to play keyboard manager and offer alternatives for formation/line up/tactics. But, I just get the feeling that some of you are a bit too convinced in your own assessments.

I mean, ultimately:

1 - None of us are professional football managers (unless there are some secret posters on here).
2 - None of us have even 1% of the information about the squad that Selles has in terms of seeing them train day-in, day-out, their physical/mental state and the positions they want to play in.

No doubt someone will reply "You don't need to be an expert to point out the obvious things that Selles is doing wrong and how to fix them" - To which I would reply, you have to be pretty delusional to believe that you can see 'obvious' things that a professional football manager can't.

We're all perfectly entitled to point out that what Selles is doing isn't working. But I wouldn't for a second believe that I know that answer.

[Snowflake Royal]

In. The manager makes no difference. Unless there is evidence that he has lost the players, of which I've seen none, then stick with him. No-one is going to turn this squad into one that is comfortable from relegation.

Don't bother having a manager then, save the money.

[Snowflake Royal]

I have to ask this question - does anyone here actually believe, honestly and truthfully, that they would do a better job at managing that club than Selles? I mean, don't get me wrong, it's fun to play keyboard manager and offer alternatives for formation/line up/tactics. But, I just get the feeling that some of you are a bit too convinced in your own assessments.

I mean, ultimately:

1 - None of us are professional football managers (unless there are some secret posters on here).
2 - None of us have even 1% of the information about the squad that Selles has in terms of seeing them train day-in, day-out, their physical/mental state and the positions they want to play in.

No doubt someone will reply "You don't need to be an expert to point out the obvious things that Selles is doing wrong and how to fix them" - To which I would reply, you have to be pretty delusional to believe that you can see 'obvious' things that a professional football manager can't.

We're all perfectly entitled to point out that what Selles is doing isn't working. But I wouldn't for a second believe that I know that answer.

If we have coaches to deliver and implement our ideas, yes. I think some would.

[WestYorksRoyal]

I have to ask this question - does anyone here actually believe, honestly and truthfully, that they would do a better job at managing that club than Selles? I mean, don't get me wrong, it's fun to play keyboard manager and offer alternatives for formation/line up/tactics. But, I just get the feeling that some of you are a bit too convinced in your own assessments.

I mean, ultimately:

1 - None of us are professional football managers (unless there are some secret posters on here).
2 - None of us have even 1% of the information about the squad that Selles has in terms of seeing them train day-in, day-out, their physical/mental state and the positions they want to play in.

No doubt someone will reply "You don't need to be an expert to point out the obvious things that Selles is doing wrong and how to fix them" - To which I would reply, you have to be pretty delusional to believe that you can see 'obvious' things that a professional football manager can't.

We're all perfectly entitled to point out that what Selles is doing isn't working. But I wouldn't for a second believe that I know that answer.

Good point. Fans aren't allowed opinions as they're not experts. Let's just shut down the team board and move on.

[Snowflake Royal]

Let's be clear here. The bar to better is exceptionally low.

This is the worst start to the season over 12 games in terms of loss rate I can think of, ever, and this is the lowest level we've played for 20 years.

It's only better by 1 point in terms of results (and we've been deducted 4!) to the last time we got relegated from the PL when we were uttely out of our depth.

Our manager arrived with a career loss rate over 50%.

He's pretty much solidfying himself as our worst ever manager. In a highly competitive field.

You'd have a fair chance to improve with a tub of lard in charge.

[YorkshireRoyal99]

I have to ask this question - does anyone here actually believe, honestly and truthfully, that they would do a better job at managing that club than Selles? I mean, don't get me wrong, it's fun to play keyboard manager and offer alternatives for formation/line up/tactics. But, I just get the feeling that some of you are a bit too convinced in your own assessments.

I mean, ultimately:

1 - None of us are professional football managers (unless there are some secret posters on here).
2 - None of us have even 1% of the information about the squad that Selles has in terms of seeing them train day-in, day-out, their physical/mental state and the positions they want to play in.

No doubt someone will reply "You don't need to be an expert to point out the obvious things that Selles is doing wrong and how to fix them" - To which I would reply, you have to be pretty delusional to believe that you can see 'obvious' things that a professional football manager can't.

We're all perfectly entitled to point out that what Selles is doing isn't working. But I wouldn't for a second believe that I know that answer.

Ironically, I think the current manager of Reims, Will Still, has mentioned that some of your FM fanatics could make good coaches. On a separate note, listen to his interview on the Coaches Voice, very good.

[Hound]

I have to ask this question - does anyone here actually believe, honestly and truthfully, that they would do a better job at managing that club than Selles? I mean, don't get me wrong, it's fun to play keyboard manager and offer alternatives for formation/line up/tactics. But, I just get the feeling that some of you are a bit too convinced in your own assessments.

I mean, ultimately:

1 - None of us are professional football managers (unless there are some secret posters on here).
2 - None of us have even 1% of the information about the squad that Selles has in terms of seeing them train day-in, day-out, their physical/mental state and the positions they want to play in.

No doubt someone will reply "You don't need to be an expert to point out the obvious things that Selles is doing wrong and how to fix them" - To which I would reply, you have to be pretty delusional to believe that you can see 'obvious' things that a professional football manager can't.

We're all perfectly entitled to point out that what Selles is doing isn't working. But I wouldn't for a second believe that I know that answer.

Ironically, I think the current manager of Reims, Will Still, has mentioned that some of your FM fanatics could make good coaches. On a separate note, listen to his interview on the Coaches Voice, very good.

I do basically agree with EPK that he is basically right, though that’s not to say managers still don’t make blatantly obvious mistakes that could be spotted by fans etc

Most managers and coaches have devoted their life to football, do weeks and weeks of courses, often brought up around football, worked with the best coaches around at some point in their life

There’s so much more it than just tactics as well, man management, fitness, psychology etc

It’s not that the FM managers couldn’t make good coaches, they’d just need to spend a lot of time properly skilling up first

[Snowflake Royal]

I have to ask this question - does anyone here actually believe, honestly and truthfully, that they would do a better job at managing that club than Selles? I mean, don't get me wrong, it's fun to play keyboard manager and offer alternatives for formation/line up/tactics. But, I just get the feeling that some of you are a bit too convinced in your own assessments.

I mean, ultimately:

1 - None of us are professional football managers (unless there are some secret posters on here).
2 - None of us have even 1% of the information about the squad that Selles has in terms of seeing them train day-in, day-out, their physical/mental state and the positions they want to play in.

No doubt someone will reply "You don't need to be an expert to point out the obvious things that Selles is doing wrong and how to fix them" - To which I would reply, you have to be pretty delusional to believe that you can see 'obvious' things that a professional football manager can't.

We're all perfectly entitled to point out that what Selles is doing isn't working. But I wouldn't for a second believe that I know that answer.

Ironically, I think the current manager of Reims, Will Still, has mentioned that some of your FM fanatics could make good coaches. On a separate note, listen to his interview on the Coaches Voice, very good.

I do basically agree with EPK that he is basically right, though that’s not to say managers still don’t make blatantly obvious mistakes that could be spotted by fans etc

Most managers and coaches have devoted their life to football, do weeks and weeks of courses, often brought up around football, worked with the best coaches around at some point in their life

There’s so much more it than just tactics as well, man management, fitness, psychology etc

It’s not that the FM managers couldn’t make good coaches, they’d just need to spend a lot of time properly skilling up first

I think it needs what we mean when a manager defined as well.

If you mean running skills and tactics based training sessions. Absolutely not a chance.

If you mean giving broad instructions for coaching to be delivered by your coaching team, man management, general direction, team selection and subsitutions, really not that hard.

[Royal_jimmy]

Let's win tonight and go from there, I'm expecting a loss to Pompey so 3 points from the next 2 is acceptable in my view. Long as we don't get smashed.

[NathStPaul]

Let's win tonight and go from there, I'm expecting a loss to Pompey so 3 points from the next 2 is acceptable in my view. Long as we don't get smashed.

If they don't win tonight does Selles have to go?

[Hound]

Ironically, I think the current manager of Reims, Will Still, has mentioned that some of your FM fanatics could make good coaches. On a separate note, listen to his interview on the Coaches Voice, very good.

I do basically agree with EPK that he is basically right, though that’s not to say managers still don’t make blatantly obvious mistakes that could be spotted by fans etc

Most managers and coaches have devoted their life to football, do weeks and weeks of courses, often brought up around football, worked with the best coaches around at some point in their life

There’s so much more it than just tactics as well, man management, fitness, psychology etc

It’s not that the FM managers couldn’t make good coaches, they’d just need to spend a lot of time properly skilling up first

I think it needs what we mean when a manager defined as well.

If you mean running skills and tactics based training sessions. Absolutely not a chance.

If you mean giving broad instructions for coaching to be delivered by your coaching team, man management, general direction, team selection and subsitutions, really not that hard.

But you’d have to get the respect of all that group by genuinely knowing what you are talking about and experiencing it

Man managing rich, Uber competitive yet probably paranoid, self doubting high performance 20 years olds…that definitely isn’t easy for example

[YorkshireRoyal99]

I have to ask this question - does anyone here actually believe, honestly and truthfully, that they would do a better job at managing that club than Selles? I mean, don't get me wrong, it's fun to play keyboard manager and offer alternatives for formation/line up/tactics. But, I just get the feeling that some of you are a bit too convinced in your own assessments.

I mean, ultimately:

1 - None of us are professional football managers (unless there are some secret posters on here).
2 - None of us have even 1% of the information about the squad that Selles has in terms of seeing them train day-in, day-out, their physical/mental state and the positions they want to play in.

No doubt someone will reply "You don't need to be an expert to point out the obvious things that Selles is doing wrong and how to fix them" - To which I would reply, you have to be pretty delusional to believe that you can see 'obvious' things that a professional football manager can't.

We're all perfectly entitled to point out that what Selles is doing isn't working. But I wouldn't for a second believe that I know that answer.

Ironically, I think the current manager of Reims, Will Still, has mentioned that some of your FM fanatics could make good coaches. On a separate note, listen to his interview on the Coaches Voice, very good.

I do basically agree with EPK that he is basically right, though that’s not to say managers still don’t make blatantly obvious mistakes that could be spotted by fans etc

Most managers and coaches have devoted their life to football, do weeks and weeks of courses, often brought up around football, worked with the best coaches around at some point in their life

There’s so much more it than just tactics as well, man management, fitness, psychology etc

It’s not that the FM managers couldn’t make good coaches, they’d just need to spend a lot of time properly skilling up first

Oh yeah of course he doesn't mean that they could walk into a job or anything like that, but he mentions that the principles of FM (for example) are not that much different to what you'd see in real life. But obviously the man management, the actual training methods etc, not to mention the qualifications, are where most would fall down. You can't just pick an FM manager and drop them into a job.

[Sanguine]

In. The manager makes no difference. Unless there is evidence that he has lost the players, of which I've seen none, then stick with him. No-one is going to turn this squad into one that is comfortable from relegation.

Don't bother having a manager then, save the money.

I don't think it will make much difference who is in charge. As I've said above, we have a squad full of players who have basically not played a league season before. Points here or there, maybe. Ultimately, difference between relegation or not, I don't think so.

[Snowflake Royal]

I do basically agree with EPK that he is basically right, though that’s not to say managers still don’t make blatantly obvious mistakes that could be spotted by fans etc

Most managers and coaches have devoted their life to football, do weeks and weeks of courses, often brought up around football, worked with the best coaches around at some point in their life

There’s so much more it than just tactics as well, man management, fitness, psychology etc

It’s not that the FM managers couldn’t make good coaches, they’d just need to spend a lot of time properly skilling up first

I think it needs what we mean when a manager defined as well.

If you mean running skills and tactics based training sessions. Absolutely not a chance.

If you mean giving broad instructions for coaching to be delivered by your coaching team, man management, general direction, team selection and subsitutions, really not that hard.

But you’d have to get the respect of all that group by genuinely knowing what you are talking about and experiencing it

Man managing rich, Uber competitive yet probably paranoid, self doubting high performance 20 years olds…that definitely isn’t easy for example

Well yes, but that's not really an intelligence, skill or training thing in the same way.

Just tell them you played in top flight obscuro leaguem

[Royal Monkey]

Let's win tonight and go from there, I'm expecting a loss to Pompey so 3 points from the next 2 is acceptable in my view. Long as we don't get smashed.

If they don't win tonight does Selles have to go?

For me lose at home to Fleetwood and he 100% absolutely should loose his job.
If we lose tonight and he doesn’t go I will absolutely not spend anymore time or money watching Reading till he and Dai are gone.
Tonight is absolute must win end of.

[Snowflake Royal]

At 10 games, I was ok, it's bad, another ten to fix it.

2 defeats later, and if we lose this one, we go up against top of the table as an absolute shambles, with 1 point in 6 games.

Anything but a win is unacceptable and I'm fully out, not just at some point in the future, but NOW.

There is no coming back from this for Selles if we lose.

[South Coast Royal]

Bindon 0 (0)
Guinness-Walker 28 (19)
Abbey 3 (0)
Azeez 34 (12)
Craig 2 (0)
Ehibhatiomhan 8 (2)

I return to our squad. Those six players above who all started at Charlton, league appearances and (starts) at the beginning of the season. Three of them had never started a league game, ever. The other three, just 33 league starts between them. And you could find fewer starts than that on our entire bench at the weekend.

We've added some useful experience in midfield in Lewis Wing, but you can't carry a comfortable mid-table season on the back of Wing, Harvey Knibbs' experience with Cambridge, and Sam Smith. This squad would be struggling in League Two.

Yes, we have a number of young players without experience of 3rd division football but they are not kids who have only played at Palmer Park or Prospect Park in kids' games.

Abbey for example has played for England at Under 17, 18 and 20 levels.
Bindon has played for USA Under 19s and the New Zealand national side.
Savage debuted for the full Welsh side last week
Mbengue -Senegal Under 23s
Craig-Scotland Under 16s to Under21s
And so on.

The experiences and coaching they have had under international coaches is probably better than they will have had under Ince and Selles at Reading and they have played the game for a number of years so are not football novices even if they are 3rd division novices.

Also our Academy players were those expected to progress to Championship level football and not just Div 1 so we might expect them to be good players even at their current tender ages and able to cope at this lower level.
They are not on their own with Button, Hutch, Wing ,Deane and Knibbs seasoned professionals to form nearly half the team plus the likes of Yiadom, Holmes and McIntyre when fit.

I don't think that it is age nor the system that are the problems it is more that the manager appears unable to get his message across and from the outside there appear to be question marks over his man management ability after the issues with Holmes, NGW and Carroll.

All in all it feels as though this current manager, who has had no success as a number 1 , isn't that good at his job and it is going to take some turnaround to convince the fans and probably both existing and future owners that he is the right man to keep us up this season let alone take us forward.
He may not have had transfer funds but that applies to many at this level however there have been six or seven additions to the playing staff where I guess he would have had some say at least in some of those signings.

Regardless of our current league position and financial constraints there are IMHO still plenty out there who would be confident enough in their own ability to want to take on the role and that might well be sooner than later with November being a favourite month in football for sackings.

[Snowflake Royal]

How long before Cheltenham get enough draws to over take us? 5/6 games? 10?