Modern football things you don't like

[Winston Biscuit]

I often see people saying we don't have the best refs in the world here, but who does? I couldn't even begin to tell you who the top 3 leagues in the world are for refereeing.

I am with Weslowskerz here. Its an impossible job to do when literally everyone else on the pitch is working hard to make them fail at their job. tackle that first and refereeing might be easier/better

[stealthpapes]

Players lying down behind a wall at a free kick
IFAB’s ******* stupid & unnecessary fiddling about with the laws of the game that mean defenders now hold their hand behind their backs when defending in the penalty area

When and why did this start?

I dimly recall a HNA vs Team Burbs game where our free kick taker drilled it under the wall as they all jumped.
But I don't think it were that ...

[stealthpapes]

I mean, generally speaking, you don't score a goal without an assist.

Data is in fact critical to modern day football and, fitness aside (which is itself supported by analytics), represents the biggest change in the sport since the 'old days' of the 20th Century.

I shared this anecdote before, a small part of what has made Rodri the player that he is - brother in law close to Etihad and had a chat with City's Sporting Director. A couple of years ago analysts found that it took Rodri around half a second longer to move the ball right to left across the pitch as it did left to right - combination of lesser first touch with his weaker foot, and less efficient weight transfer. He got an injury, and during his lay-off of a few months, the club put together a specific training plan to address this, technique, certain exercises etc, and improved that timing gap. There's little doubt that Rodri has been the best midfielder in the world in the last two years.

You might/probably think this is data-driven bullshit, but it speaks of the margins at which elite players operate, the tiny gains that can make a difference at the top level.

The amount of stat presented to fans is just an off-shoot of the availability of more analytics. Maybe it could be better targeted, but it does mean something. No stats are truly subjective.

I reckon I've a post from at least five years ago making this point.

The stats that the media and the viewing public use are not the same as the data and analysis clubs use.

All the rest is old man shakes fist at cloud.

[genome]

Field Tilt is my new favourite one

[Sutekh]

Field Tilt is my new favourite one

Is that a reminder to Salford’s manager about remembering to play their star defender?

[stealthpapes]

Field Tilt is my new favourite one

Didn't he play a few games under Stam?

[Snowflake Royal]

standard of refs in the U.K.

I struggle to agree with this based on the following:

- The ref is a single person, in the middle of a pitch. Surrounded by 22 top athletes and players, all berating him
- There are 10,000 up to 75,000 (PL) in the ground all berating the ref
- There are two managers, plus about 10 others at the sidelines shouting at the ref and berating him
- After the game, the media spend 3-4 days playing the single split second decision over and over, often with pundits all torn on the right answer.

- All the players, spend the game often:

Cheating
Trying to deceive the ref
Elaborating just how bad a tackle was
Feigning injury
Lying about something, such as when a ball CLEARLY touches them and they go nuts as if it's their ball
Abusing the ref

...

Not for a second saying the refs are good (or bad), just saying that I think they should be given a bit of a free pass, until the players all stop cheating every single fecking minute of the game.

I'd have sympathy for this view. If it wasn’t for the fact that ref's not only allowed it to become the state of affairs by not using the powers available to them to stamp it out at birth, but actively encouraged much of it by getting rattled and being influenced in their decision making for being berated, and almost never giving a freekick or penalty for fouling unless a player goes to ground, even if they're very clearly being impeded.

[Sanguine]

Tbf to the media, the obviously silly/complex stuff doesn't really translate doesn't last long - see the brief obsession with 'scans', and Carra presenting stills of midfielders 'scanning' over their shoulder, as if footballers looking around the pitch was some kind of new science.

[leon]

Tbf to the media, the obviously silly/complex stuff doesn't really translate doesn't last long - see the brief obsession with 'scans', and Carra presenting stills of midfielders 'scanning' over their shoulder, as if footballers looking around the pitch was some kind of new science.

“Carra” file under “Trent” as the fcuking annoying English Liverpool obsession.

Thieving fcuks.

[Sanguine]

Tbf to the media, the obviously silly/complex stuff doesn't really translate doesn't last long - see the brief obsession with 'scans', and Carra presenting stills of midfielders 'scanning' over their shoulder, as if footballers looking around the pitch was some kind of new science.

“Carra” file under “Trent” as the fcuking annoying English Liverpool obsession.

Thieving fcuks.

Okay.

[stealthpapes]

Tbf to the media, the obviously silly/complex stuff doesn't really translate doesn't last long - see the brief obsession with 'scans', and Carra presenting stills of midfielders 'scanning' over their shoulder, as if footballers looking around the pitch was some kind of new science.

There is one great example of how that matters.



It's off-screen at the start of the gif, but the whole story of Gerrard having to move where he played further and further backwards is a result of his decreasing ability to read the game.

BUT lol yeh 'greed

[URZZZZ]

Same teams just alternate between the top end of the Championship and then a relegation fight in the Prem. Burnley, Leeds, Sheffield United, West Brom etc etc. Leicester, Ipswich and Southampton (the three promoted sides last season) likely to be the same three teams that subsequently get relegated this season. Always been an element of this but the gap has gotten wider and wider. Ipswich had 0 shots in the game up until the 70th minute yesterday

How “robotic” and “programmed” the game has become. It’s almost like players don’t have the capacity to think for themselves. Watching teams try and chase games in the dying stages of games is particularly amusing. 96 minutes on the clock, and they’re still slowly passing around their back looking for an “angle” as opposed to just sending the entire team forward, launching the ball in the box and seeing what happens

[Sanguine]

Same teams just alternate between the top end of the Championship and then a relegation fight in the Prem. Burnley, Leeds, Sheffield United, West Brom etc etc. Leicester, Ipswich and Southampton (the three promoted sides last season) likely to be the same three teams that subsequently get relegated this season.

I've posted before, but there is a real recency bias in this supposed stat. I think the number of different sides promoted to the PL in the last 10-15 years is more than 20. Essentially that in that time around half of our 92 PL and EFL clubs have played in the top division.

You've also got a current PL mid-table full of teams promoted in recent seasons and that have established themselves in the league - Fulham, Brentford, Bournemouth, Brighton and Forest.

I think more the reality - whilst not denying the financial leg up 'yoyo-ing' gives you - is that so many teams have had a shot at the big time that they all look like big sides now.

[stealthpapes]

Same teams just alternate between the top end of the Championship and then a relegation fight in the Prem. Burnley, Leeds, Sheffield United, West Brom etc etc. Leicester, Ipswich and Southampton (the three promoted sides last season) likely to be the same three teams that subsequently get relegated this season.

I've posted before, but there is a real recency bias in this supposed stat. I think the number of different sides promoted to the PL in the last 10-15 years is more than 20. Essentially that in that time around half of our 92 PL and EFL clubs have played in the top division.

You've also got a current PL mid-table table full of teams promoted in recent seasons and that have established themselves in the league - Fulham, Brentford, Bournemouth, Brighton and Forest.

I think more the reality - whilst not denying the financial leg up 'yoyo-ing' gives you - is that so many teams have had a shot at the big time that they all look like big sides now.

Leeds, Leicester, Southampton also arguably big teams that have been down, rather than small teams on the up.

[Sanguine]

2010/11 - QPR, Norwich, Swansea
2011/12 - Reading, Southampton, West Ham
2012/13 - Cardiff, Hull, Palace
2013/14 - Leicester, Burnley, QPR
2014/15 - Bournemouth, Watford, Norwich
2015/16 - Burnley, Middlesbrough, Hull
2016/17 - Newcastle, Brighton, Huddersfield
2017/18 - Wolves, Cardiff, Fulham
2018/19 - Norwich, Sheff Utd, Villa
2019/20 - Leeds, West Brom, Fulham
2020/21 - Norwich, Watford, Brentford
2021/22 - Fulham, Bournemouth, Forest
2022/23 - Burnley, Sheff Utd, Luton
2023/24 - Leicester, Ipswich, Southampton

So if you go back 15 seasons, 27 different teams have achieved promotion to the PL. And so far there isn't a year where a 'new' side has not been added to that. Sunderland might make it 28 this season.

Of course it is hard to go up and stay up. But the teams in red are current PL sides - 13 of them, with six of those (West Ham, Palace, Newcastle, Brighton, Villa, Wolves) having been in the top flight for five seasons or more.

[Sanguine]

Addition to the stat.

Teams not listed above that have been relegated in that timeframe and not returned - (8) Birmingham, Blackpool, Bolton, Blackburn, Wigan, Sunderland, Stoke, Swansea.
PL 'ever-presents' in that timeframe - (7) Arsenal, Liverpool, City, United, Everton, Chelsea, Spurs.

And I make that 42 of the 92 PL and EFL teams that have dined at the top table in the last 15 seasons, however briefly. Money might be more of a barrier than ever to establishing oneself in the top flight (although the likes of Brighton and Brentford are showing it can be done) - but it isn't stopping teams getting a shot at the big time.

[Dirk Gently]

Yes, but it is precisely that - "a shot at the big time."

It's almost like the Premier League having one place spare just to show the little clubs what it's like for a year or maybe two - "Your turn to come and be our whipping boy for a season."

They're not taken seriously and everyone knows they're not competitive and it'll only be a fleeting visit.

Obvious exceptions apply, but you have to think that the likes of Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth and Forest will fizzle out in a number of years, and then the fall will be financially damaging. qv Wigan & Bolton who were once pretty established PL clubs.

[Winston Biscuit]

how every PL club (and some lower) seems to now have some kind of unofficial voice of the fan type person, who runs a club youtube channel and is just the loudest person among their fans. From what I have seen they are almost always youngsters with armfuls of stats, pretty terrible opinions on the game, and a very high opinion of themselves. and they always have stupid names too.

[Sanguine]

Yes, but it is precisely that - "a shot at the big time."

It's almost like the Premier League having one place spare just to show the little clubs what it's like for a year or maybe two - "Your turn to come and be our whipping boy for a season."

They're not taken seriously and everyone knows they're not competitive and it'll only be a fleeting visit.

Obvious exceptions apply, but you have to think that the likes of Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth and Forest will fizzle out in a number of years, and then the fall will be financially damaging. qv Wigan & Bolton who were once pretty established PL clubs.

Nah, come on. You've got more than 40 teams in a relatively short time period playing in the Premier League, and you've got a host of established and current mid-table clubs that have been promoted in recent seasons. It's no argument at all to just say 'well, they will go down in the end eventually'.

It's simple. Being a Premier League team is hard. Some teams manage to stay there, some don't. When there are only 7 'ever-presents' out of 20 teams, it shows that only the biggest clubs are basically immune from relegation, which is basically always been the case anyway.

[Sutekh]

how every PL club (and some lower) seems to now have some kind of unofficial voice of the fan type person, who runs a club youtube channel and is just the loudest person among their fans. From what I have seen they are almost always youngsters with armfuls of stats, pretty terrible opinions on the game, and a very high opinion of themselves. and they always have stupid names too.

Thankfully this is not something that troubles Reading.