Old Timey Football Thread

[Winston Biscuit]

Colourised video of Glentoran Vs Cliftonville from 1897

https://youtu.be/hUJVaH7AP4I?si=ZZNpg8qBC6llAYT0

[stealthpapes]

really interesting It Was What It Was podcast this morning which is on the 84/85 season and the violence going on at games. Lots of incidents I didn't know about, as behaviour at matches really deteriorated. The end of season includes the Bradford fire and Heysal.

That season also had Birmingham vs Leeds, same day, lad on his first game gets killed as a wall gave way and horses on the pitch, and, in a FA cup replay iirc, the fighting on the pitch riot of Luton vs Millwall.

[Winston Biscuit]

Today is 100 years to the day that the modern offside law was brought in!

Ive mentioned it before on here as its one of my favourite english football history moments. changing it from 3 oppo players needed fo to be onside, to 2, and heralding a number of seasons of chaotic defences and record breaking seasons of goals, with Dixie Dean one of the biggest beneficiaries.

Good episode today from the It Was What It Was podcast

[bakerlou]

Today is 100 years to the day that the modern offside law was brought in!

Ive mentioned it before on here as its one of my favourite english football history moments. changing it from 3 oppo players needed fo to be onside, to 2, and heralding a number of seasons of chaotic defences and record breaking seasons of goals, with Dixie Dean one of the biggest beneficiaries.

Good episode today from the It Was What It Was podcast

Dixie Dean's record of 60 goals in a season (in 27/28) bettered George Camsell's record of 59 the season before.

Just to assess how impactful that change in the offside law was, the previous record until Camsell broke it was 44.

[Winston Biscuit]

Was looking at the history of the transfer record and then delving more into some of them

The first £100 player only happened because Villa were found to have 'illegally poached' West Brom's star goalscorer Willie Groves, and so the FA ordered them to pay a fine of £100 to West Brom.

From the start of organised football all record transfers were between British clubs until 1932 when River Plate more than doubled the record to sign Bernabé Ferreyra from cross city rivals Tigre. Ferreyra was a prolific goalscorer for them, won titles there and has gone down as one of their greatest ever players. It was also such a large amount of money that the record wasn't broken for another 17 years.

Since 1951, English clubs have only broken the world record twice. Shearer in 1996 and Pogba in 2016

[Sutekh]

And if anyone was wondering, the current world record (in fact both the top 2 highest value) transfer is held by Paris Saint Germain spending €222m (£200m) on Neymar in 2017. Makes the €180m (£163m) they then spent on Mbappe a year later look a bargain.

Record British transfer is £116m by Liverpool for Florian Wirtz (presuming he passes his medical), just ahead of the £115m paid by Chelsea for Moses Caicedo (still the record between British clubs).

[Winston Biscuit]

And if anyone was wondering, the current world record (in fact both the top 2 highest value) transfer is held by Paris Saint Germain spending €222m (£200m) on Neymar in 2017. Makes the €180m (£163m) they then spent on Mbappe a year later look a bargain.

Record British transfer is £116m by Liverpool for Florian Wirtz (presuming he passes his medical), just ahead of the £115m paid by Chelsea for Moses Caicedo (still the record between British clubs).

what is the record is debatable though I guess. basic amount vs add ons, how much of the add on gets paid, exchange rate at the time etc.

[Winston Biscuit]

I only learned today that in the 1982 world cup draw, England, Scotland and Northern Ireland were not allowed to be put into the same group as Argentina due to the Falklands war.

Also the 82 world cup draw was a totsl shambles and they had to amend it as they went

[tmesis]

I only learned today that in the 1982 world cup draw, England, Scotland and Northern Ireland were not allowed to be put into the same group as Argentina due to the Falklands war.

The draw took place nearly three months before Argentina invaded, so unless FIFA had some inside information from the then World Champions, it seems unlikely.

[Winston Biscuit]

[Sutekh]

I only learned today that in the 1982 world cup draw, England, Scotland and Northern Ireland were not allowed to be put into the same group as Argentina due to the Falklands war.

The draw took place nearly three months before Argentina invaded, so unless FIFA had some inside information from the then World Champions, it seems unlikely.

Think, if true, that that original statement would relate to the 1986 World Cup draw as the invasion of the Falkland islands wasn’t until the beginning of April 1982 so- as noted - how would FIFA have known to prevent the possibility of them playing each other in the groups at the draw, which I think was held in January 1982?

It obviously didn’t in the end, but there was serious talk at the time that Thatcher’s government would step in to tell the FA, IFA and SFA to withdraw England, Northern Ireland and Scotland from the finals and set up an alternative tournament amongst themselves

The first game England played against Argentina after the Falklands war was THAT game in 1986.

[BRO_BOT]

I only learned today that in the 1982 world cup draw, England, Scotland and Northern Ireland were not allowed to be put into the same group as Argentina due to the Falklands war.

The draw took place nearly three months before Argentina invaded, so unless FIFA had some inside information from the then World Champions, it seems unlikely.

Think, if true, that that original statement would relate to the 1986 World Cup draw as the invasion of the Falkland islands wasn’t until the beginning of April 1982 so- as noted - how would FIFA have known to prevent the possibility of them playing each other in the groups at the draw, which I think was held in January 1982?

It obviously didn’t in the end, but there was serious talk at the time that Thatcher’s government would step in to tell the FA, IFA and SFA to withdraw England, Northern Ireland and Scotland from the finals and set up an alternative tournament amongst themselves

The first game England played against Argentina after the Falklands war was THAT game in 1986.

The FA's Head of Light Banter should have insisted on a Falkand Islander being in the squad for the game

[Dirk Gently]

The draw took place nearly three months before Argentina invaded, so unless FIFA had some inside information from the then World Champions, it seems unlikely.

Think, if true, that that original statement would relate to the 1986 World Cup draw as the invasion of the Falkland islands wasn’t until the beginning of April 1982 so- as noted - how would FIFA have known to prevent the possibility of them playing each other in the groups at the draw, which I think was held in January 1982?

It obviously didn’t in the end, but there was serious talk at the time that Thatcher’s government would step in to tell the FA, IFA and SFA to withdraw England, Northern Ireland and Scotland from the finals and set up an alternative tournament amongst themselves

The first game England played against Argentina after the Falklands war was THAT game in 1986.

The FA's Head of Light Banter should have insisted on a Falkand Islander being in the squad for the game

Or have the mascots accompanying the team out all from the ranks of the Parachute Regiment...

[Winston Biscuit]

45 years ago today Diego Maradona signed for Boca Juniors as a 20 years old. He had already played 5 seasons for Argentinos Juniors and was in demand everywhere, with offers from Europe and with River Plate telling him they would make him the highest paid player in Argentina if he joined them. He was determined to play for Boca, and even though they struggled to be able to afford him, a deal was struck where he would go on loan to them first, then payments would be spread over a longer than usual period of time, and a friendly was played between the 2 clubs where he played 45 minutes for both clubs to help bring in more money for the selling club

[Winston Biscuit]

Went down a rabbit hole of lower league Scottish football and learned about the 2nd tier 95/96 campaign. Seen as one of the best ever by many. 4 clubs were fighting all season for top spot, and with Dundee Utd slipping up at the end it allowed Dunfermline to clinch the title. the season ended with the top 3 separated by just 4 points, and the top 4 separated by 6 points.

Also a season in which Dunfermline's captain, and 15 year servant, Norrie Mcathie, died mid season from carbon monoxide poisoning alongside his girlfriend at home.

[Winston Biscuit]

Dukla Prague beating Ajax in the QF of the European Cup 66/67



(We know what we all want for Christmas)

[Sutekh]

Dukla Prague beating Ajax in the QF of the European Cup 66/67



(We know what we all want for Christmas)

40 years old this year….

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=na12OyJ ... rt_radio=1

So much better than Oasis

[Winston Biscuit]

Herbert Kilpin - En Englishman born in Nottingham in 1870 and moved to Italy aged 21 to work for a textile company. had played football in England before the move and was hugely passionate about it, and arrived in Italy as football clubs were just starting to get created.

Helped to create AC Milan in 1898, choosing their colours, and was their star player, captain, manager, and basically ran the whole club for a while and his enthusiasm and hard work is seen as one of the biggest reasons AC Milan went from an idea to an established club. They were national champions 2 years after they were created, and by the time he finished playing for them 9 years after he started, they had been national champions a total of 3 times.

Not a person well known here, but is held in very high regard in Milan, and is often celebrated there, and as such is a name that is known across Italian football. In 2024 his remains were moved to Milan’s 'Monumentale Cemetery', where the most significant people of Milan are buried

[Ark Royal]

Dukla Prague beating Ajax in the QF of the European Cup 66/67



(We know what we all want for Christmas)

40 years old this year….

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=na12OyJ ... rt_radio=1

So much better than Oasis

Weird photo! I think the Ajax player shaking hands is a very young John Cruyff, and the Dukla player in the foreground appears to be wearing glasses.

[South Coast Royal]

Did anybody else watch the re-run of the 1966 World Cup Final yesterday , in colour on channel 4?

On the day I was due to play cricket but it was called off after heavy rain and the pitch at Wembley was quite heavy, much more so than I remember.
It wasn't the BBC commentary and it was just the one person for most of the game.

A few observations:-

The players from both sides were more skilled than I expected, standouts for us being Moore, Peters, Ball and Charlton.
There was much more shooting on sight but not very accurate
Free kicks were taken quickly, as were throw-ins
Players were generally more wiry in build than muscular
Alan Ball's energy was outstanding.
Gordon Banks was a great keeper
Not much complaining to the ref, other than by Alan Ball
Germany looked more dangerous than I remembered
The crowd sang "When the Reds (England on the day) go marching in"
The queen seemed to enjoy it.
Commentary was a bit more cutting than we hear now, e.g. "that pass was useless" and "I don't think the German defender is injured" and "the German goalkeeper looks dodgy".

Later on I watched just the first half of England's friendly against the mighty New Zealand.
It was so boring that I turned over to Sky to watch boxing and Chris Billam-Smith in one of the fights of the century and am glad that I did.